To Aru Majutsu No Index Feats/Discussion/Analysis Thread - Touma's Boogaloo Edition

[Astaro]

NT16 getting adapted and Kihara Yuiitsu makes her debut. They definitely nailed the “Kihara Noukan fangirl” aspect with that voice

 

[Top59]

New manga, is an ITEM's LN adaptation.

 

[Cryso Agori]

That quickly the novel just released didn't it?

 

[Astaro]

It is a one-shot so a manga version can be done quickly.

 

[Top59]

That quickly the novel just released didn't it?

Yeah, it came out a few hours ago.

 

[Top59]

It's more curiosity than anything else, but remember when Mr OMG said that in ToAru's PSP fighting game Kihara mentioned Mugino's Meltdowner interacting with 0-D matter?

In this novel they mention that again.

Mugino Shizuri.

Level 5 Meltdowner.

One of the seven current Level 5s. By firing electrons in a state that is neither a particle nor a wave, her power creates a strong resistance that applies massive heat and friction to the target and forcibly burns through it. As a weapon, this power is classified as a high-speed particle-wave cannon. By its nature, this power is expected to have a wide-variety of research applications, including new weapons development, proof of zero-dimensional matter, and non-laser nuclear fusion reactors. Her power has the highly unique property of manipulating the state of an electron no matter who is observing it, which could have applications in a new type of quantum computer, quantum cryptography, highly flexible AI development, and next-generation high-volume high-speed communications. (Note: Some results of this research have begun to be incorporated into the Aneri Project, among others. See separate entry for details.)

There is a risk of mutual interference with the Railgun, another electric Level 5. Be cognizant of this when designing their research facilities.

I really don't know what mean by that, if it can affect matter without mass or something else, I really don't know but it made me curious that in a PSP game from so many years ago mentioned that before.

 

[Astaro]

Glad to see how power is being explored more thoroughly and we may even see new applications other than spamming lasers.

Mugino always felt like the oddball of the Level 5s, her powers the most mundane and with the least amount of applications.

She honestly seemed more like a strong Level 4 when you compare her to the kind of stuff the other Level 5s can pull off with their powers

 

[Astaro]

Twitter account for the artist behind the Mugino spin-off releasing their artwork for the Meltdowner herself

 

[Astaro]

Another cool reference for how the cosmology of the series works. Bold part seems to confirm that yes, even the current universe the story takes place in is a phase too

"While all those fools are focused on the visible chaos, I will take my time preparing for the end. I am the Great Demon lurking in the Abyss of the Sephiroth. But ascending the tree is not the only way to use it." She pointed her thumb at the center of her chest. "I obtained this physical body and descended the tree. The humans drowning at the bottom level only ever think of ascending it, but the connections go both ways. I started higher up and I can freely come and go, so this temporary level does not matter to me. Having a physical body is not a bad thing since it provides practical benefits in this world. And it allows me to reach the physical and scientific layer at the very bottom where all other phases are folded up."

"The bottom?"

"Yes. Imagine the universe at the point when the geocentric model said the other planets revolved around the earth. That is different from current mainstream astrology, but this is about some simple mental exercise. …But make sure this hypothetical does not confuse you. Now, with that model, the forces storing up mystical and supernatural power pour down on the earth from outside of the planet, but the earth in the center is a perfectly ordinary hunk of dirt. That is the earth's surface where we are standing now. If you removed that, the world would lose its center and it would fall apart, correct?"

Coronzon raised her slender index finger and slowly spun it around.

When she did, a few of the large plates around them began to rotate. They appeared to be representing the view of the world before it was proven that the planets revolved around the sun.

"By passing all that power through this foundational layer, that 'bottom' layer can be broken and removed. From there, all other phases will be destroyed along with this one. Without the core, the other forces cannot maintain their revolutions."

She clenched her fist and took a step from the center.

With their directions from the "core" gone, the large plates scattered blindly and bumped into each other.

A single action caused it all to fall apart.

"Aleister apparently wanted to save humanity by destroying every other phase and leaving just this one behind, but I am the opposite. By removing the 'bottom' layer at the center, the phases for all mythologies and religions will be destroyed. That is the Ceremony of Mo Athair. Nothing at all will remain afterwards."

 

[Astaro]

Hey @Mr.OMG where's this from?

At the end of the world, God would descend down to the mortal world and decide everyone's fate, whether they were going to heaven or to hell. If a person who shouldn't be killed was dead, his children wouldn't be born. If that happened, his grandchildren and great-grandchildren wouldn't be born. That was why those who could control time and space were those supremacists who could control history. The angels who escaped from the history of humanity also had the power to change humanity's future.

 

[One and Only]

Hey @Mr.OMG where's this from?

OT 4 chapter 3 part 3...

 

[Astaro]

@Top59 What do you think of this calc done for Gabriel’s Astro in Hand?

Now, I have a lot else I'd like to say here but considering that the other people are busy arguing about those nuances and since there have been claims about the solar system level Astro in Hand, I did a little calc-

Assume that we are talking about a gravitationally bound system between our current location with respect to the Sun and a distant star. A quick google search reveals that the furthest night star we can see with the naked eye is a little over 4000 light-years away in the constellation Cassiopeia, and has a weight of about 500 solar masses. The maximum distance we can see is more or less 30 billion light-years. The energy needed to yeet this star to the maximum distance visible to us can see so can be found quite easily through the formula of gravitational potential energy.

The negative sign here indicates that the potential energy is binding in nature. Applying this with respect to the system of our solar system and the star in question. We can find the potential difference between the point where the star stops being visible to us to its the current position relative to the earth. That difference is equal to the total work needed to be done to drag that star from its current location to the nearest point where Gabriel threw it, or in other words the energy needed to do this feat.

The mass of the star= 9.9455 x 10^33 kilograms
The mass of Solar system= 1.9891 × 10^30 kilograms
The distances, r1 and r2 respectively= 3.784 × 10^18 meteres and 2.838 x 10^27 meteres
Constant G=6.67 x 10^-11

Thus the energy needed to move the single further star we can see outside our visual range, now this is as accurate as I can get which is by 15 decimal points- 1.76268475440451 x 10^39 Joules

Now, this is the energy needed to move the star which according to google is the furthest one we can see in the night sky and gravity is a force that is inversely proportional to the square of the distance. Meaning, as we get further the force needed decreases exponentially. So, the stars which are closer to us would require literally trillions to septillions times more energy needed to perform the same feat. Also, the gravity of the sun is obviously not the only force that's keeping these stars in their place. There are planets, stars, and galaxies whose gravity also binds these stars. Then there's the fact that these stars have varying masses. Then there's the fact that Fiamma can manipulate every star in the universe, not just the measly amount we see.

There are 400 billion stars in our night sky

Assuming average conditions, to yeet them all outside our visible range we need- 7.05073901762 x 10^52 joules of energy. That's about galaxy level and this is an exponential lowball, the actual energy should be trillions or septillions times higher considering the inverse square law and the distances involved. Experts are free to check this.

Got it from this thread

Saitama (OPM) vs Chaos (FGO) vs Fiamma of the Right (Toaru)

Not that hard to look at previous pages. >Gabriel being able to control all stars in the universe >Cortanna being able to cut all universes and dimensions, capable of harming Aiwass the anti-magic God dude because it draws power from angel which LPASD Fiamma is above Oh, but where is the feats...

forums.spacebattles.com

 

[Top59]

@Top59 What do you think of this calc done for Gabriel’s Astro in Hand?



Got it from this thread

Saitama (OPM) vs Chaos (FGO) vs Fiamma of the Right (Toaru)

Not that hard to look at previous pages. >Gabriel being able to control all stars in the universe >Cortanna being able to cut all universes and dimensions, capable of harming Aiwass the anti-magic God dude because it draws power from angel which LPASD Fiamma is above Oh, but where is the feats...

forums.spacebattles.com

It has three problematic points for how the calculations are taken here.

1-He assume that Gabriel moved all the stars in the universe at the same time, we don't really know that, Gabriel can move any star in the universe but it is not the same as moving all of them at the same time.

2-The inverse square law is true, in fact I have used it to measure things but here I think it is only valid for shock waves or explosions, something like telekinesis (astrokinesis) I think not, if Gabriel's feat from moving the stars out by an explosion would be valid.

Thus the energy needed to move the single further star we can see outside our visual range, now this is as accurate as I can get which is by 15 decimal points- 1.76268475440451 x 10^39 Joules

3-The first calculation of moving a single star was done assuming the minimum to move a single star, but Gabriel moved the stars at FTL speeds, in itself I can't use KE but I can use it GBE (which is valid here) which is better.

We can't get the kinetic energy out of things faster than light so I'll use the GBE of the Sun

Sun's GBE is 6.87e+41J

ToAru feats calculation

What you mean "makes it clear it was annihilation"? The word "annihilation" isn't officially defined as subatomic destruction. That's just a fan made way to refer to it. And you underestimate dark matter. Being entirely different laws of physics with different photons and stuff it goes all the...

www.fanverse.org

 

[Astaro]

Latest Index chapter has Touma and Floris’ daring escape and the bit with Sister Agnese’s method of interrogating a poor Knight

Fun chapter. Don’t think the latter made it in the anime did it?

Looks like next chapter will pick back up on William vs Knight Leader

Hope the manga covers the parts of the fight that were skipped in the anime. Manga’s done a fine job so far

 

[Astaro]

Hmmm…

Favorites: Touma, Accelerator, Hamazura, Misaka, Othinus, Kanzaki, Acqua, Kakine, Itsuwa

Love: Aleister, Index, Shokuhou, Fiamma, Mugino, Gunha, Kuroko, Saten, Uiharu, Leivinia, Carissa, Frenda, Aradia, Bologna Succubus, Qliphah Puzzle 545, Nephthys, Kihara Noukan

Like: Kazakiri, Marian, Bersi, Last Order, Misaka-Imouto, Misaka Worst, Laura Stuart / Coronzon, Stiyl, Kinuhata, Dion Fortune, Drencher Kihara, Alice, Niang-Niang, High Priest, Tsuchimikado, St. Germain, Roberto

Neutral: Takitsubo, Salome, Karasuma Fran

Dislike: Kamisato, Anna Sprengel

Hate: Vento

 

[Astaro]

Favorite: Hokaze Junko, Thor, Orsola, Esther, Ollerus,

Love: Fukiyose, Queen Elizard, Yomikawa, Vivana Oniguma

Like: Komoe Tsukuyomi, Aureolus Izzard, Etzali, Villian, Musujime Awaki, Aiwass, Luca, Brunhild, Gokusai Kaibi, Kanou, Hattori, Komaba, Kuruwa, Rakuoka, Tsuzuri, Frillsand #G, Kihara Amata, and Nayuta

Neutral: Himegami, Aogami, Angeline, Rimea, All the New Light girls, Fremea, Fraulein, Freyja, Cendrillon, Saronia, Kihara Yuiitsu and Enshuu

Dislike: Agnese, Lucia, Silvia, Benizome Jellyfish

Hate: Biagio, Kihara Hassu and Byouri

 

[Paxton]

The cross in the palm held in front of him popped and began its expansion. “Biagioooooooooooooo!!” At the very same time, he sent his fist flying at the accessory. Not his right—but his left.

Even an amateur could tell his nondominant hand’s strike was much weaker. Compared to his right fist, which he always used to punch, its speed was overshadowed. But his left fist was different in one other respect. It didn’t have the Imagine Breaker’s power in it. “!!” The cross Biagio was gripping bounced a little from Kamijou’s left fist. With a soft tink, the accessory in his hand had simply changed its direction slightly.

However… The cross, facing in a different direction than Biagio had planned, expanded very quickly. Boom!! The tip of the cross that had been in his hand now stabbed his jaw. “Ghbah?!” Biagio’s body sprang straight up. This…little…He used my own attack…!! He could think, but he had no room to speak. The whole inside of his mouth stung with pain.

Remember that time Touma punched away a cross whose weight was amplified several thousands (iirc) of times over?

I do wonder what kind of numbers you'd get from calcing this

 

[Astaro]

Remember that time Touma punched away a cross whose weight was amplified several thousands (iirc) of times over?

I do wonder what kind of numbers you'd get from calcing this

The wording implies Touma struck the cross to reposition it just before it expanded so that it would whack Biagio. It’s why he used his left hand rather than Imagine Breaker which would just destroy it.

The manga goes with Touma hitting it before it expanded too.

 

[Astaro]

Speaking of Biagio, can’t believe his Seiyuu is the same guy who voices Cell. Just learned that today.

Best DBZ villain doing the voice for most forgettable Index villain.

 

[Astaro]

Favorites: None

Love: Knight Leader, Kumokawa Seria, Hojou Arei, Rakko and Iruka Yumiya, Yuuri Senya, Oriana Thompson, Yuzuriha Ringo, Kiyama Harumi, Sakuragi Naruha, Kouzaku Mitori, Will of the Misaka Network, Kongou Mitsuko.

Like: Ladybird, Kaai and Youen Hanatsuyu, Oumi Shuri, Kumokawa Maria, Houjou Seigo, Mitsuari Ayu, Umidori, Iizumi Rita (Scavenger Leader), Seike, Yakumaru, Dolly, Maidono Hoshimi, Wannai, Awatsuki, Fake Touma

Neutral: Mjolnir, Sigyn, Utgarda-Loki, Saflee, Sasha, Vasilisa, Archangel Gabriel, Elizalina, Stephanie, Yobou Banka, Xochitli, Kamijou Touya, Misaka Tabigake, Rikura and Amazora Gokusais

Dislike: Terra, Kihara Souji, Therestina, Kihara Gensei

Hate: Baba Yoshio