Fate Characters fight their Charyeok users.

Cryso Agori · Jan 11, 2022

1. Berserker Hercules(feats from all sources) vs Samuel Rosinante, Borrowed Power Hercules (Executive Q, Ryong fight feats not allowed)

2. Saber Ibuki Douji(feats from all sources) vs Kyoichi Kusanagi, Borrowed Power Yamato No Orochi (Executive X)

3. Rider Iskander(feats from all sources) vs Alexandros, Borrowed Power Emperor Iskander (Consolation Match Arc)

4. Berserker Jack The Ripper(feats from all sources if there's any outside F/SF) vs Gwum Gi, Borrowed Power Jack The Ripper (Sage Realm Arc)

5. Ruler Jeanne D' Arc(feats from all sources) vs Andre Oscar, Borrowed Power Jeanne D' Arc (Nationals Arc)

6. Saber Siegfried(feats from all sources) vs Moon Gi-Joo, Borrowed Power Paladin Siegfried (Post-Ragnarok)

7. Berserker Lu Bu Fengxian(feats from all sources) vs Yu Mi-Ra, Borrowed Power Yeo-Po Bong-Seon also called Lu Bu Fengxian (Sage Realm Arc)

Location: Empty Planet

In-character

Start 100 meters apart.

Who wins?

If Fate characters stomp, then use current versions of GOH characters.

If GOH characters stomp, fate characters can be composited with other classes.

Xhominid The Apex · Jan 11, 2022

What is any of these characters on the right can do first and foremost? I'm not all that huge with GOH.

Xhominid The Apex · Jan 11, 2022

But FYI, alot of them will most likely get effortlessly rolled on.
Heracles was able to block Loptr Laejrn with zero assistance for a second without dying despite the sheer super-effectiveness against him and it being Rhongomyniad's equal AND took a Planet Destroying Noble Phantasm from LB Artemis and didn't die(and no, those Shields did dick to stop it considering in Okeanos Artemis STILL stated it was either one shot or multiple lives would be lost if she had her full Divinity and Chaldeas' Shields didn't do shit either despite being ludicrously reinforced)

Saber Ibuki Douji's fragmented version of her Noble Phantasm can create 8 valleys and 8 lakes which would virtually be Country level right there and that's not counting if that's the actual True Name Release or not.

Iskandar can canonically fight Altera on equal ground who is was compared to a Dragon at first which are Country Busters

Berserker Jack The Ripper... well, I know you heard about him so it's obvious he basically murders here.

Ruler Jeanne D'Arc is canonically stronger than her Archer version who can generate an Ocean as a by-product of her Noble Phantasm(Not her Noble Phantasm, just the byproduct).

Siegfried is seen as Karna's rival and is canonically stronger than Sieg-Fried whose only + was having Galvanism but could otherwise not even use the true power of Balmung and still did this:

With a Mana Burst enhanced Balmung Strike(No, this is NOT a True Name Release and he still created what is equivalent to Mountains from the sheer earthquake of the resulting strike). That's not forgetting the fact that again, he killed Fafnir... a Dragon so Country by default even before we get to him being seen as Karna's rival and Sigurd's equal which would knock him higher up.

And Lu Bu is capable of throwing down with Numerals Gawain, ala Saber Lancelot for an extended period of time and nearly drew with Cu in a fight to the death in CCC.

And all of them are FTL due to the numerous feats we have gotten throughout Fate that collaborates on it(Especially Lostbelt 5.1 which ultimately shows the FTL feat we see in LB5.2 wasn't assisted in the slightest and Edgemiya's dead corpse being able to react to and fire off a line to Meltryllis while she was using her Combo NP with Passionlip in the CCC Event).

Cryso Agori · Jan 11, 2022

Alright.

Xhominid The Fool said:
Heracles was able to block Loptr Laejrn with zero assistance for a second without dying despite the sheer super-effectiveness against him and it being Rhongomyniad's equal AND took a Planet Destroying Noble Phantasm from LB Artemis and didn't die(and no, those Shields did dick to stop it considering in Okeanos Artemis STILL stated it was either one shot or multiple lives would be lost if she had her full Divinity and Chaldeas' Shields didn't do shit either despite being ludicrously reinforced)

Here's Samuel's feats.

Gigantic Earth Suplex:

(http://imgur.com/a/5JtdE4f)

He can snipe with the Bow of Heracles(this is a fake though)

(http://imgur.com/a/2bMKqvJ)

He can pick up Clone Yeoui without Borrowed Power.

(http://imgur.com/a/adWYE5w)

Uriel states that a clone Yeoui weighs less than 80 million tons or 1,700,000 pounds.

(http://imgur.com/a/glHxJMW)

When using Borrowed Power he can hold and keep Yeoui from expanding.

(http://imgur.com/a/9Ywrp6e)

And this is just using his Borrowed Power. Samuel can take it a step further by using Power-Lenderization.

Since Samuel is descended from the actual Heracles, Heracles can lend him his power. When he uses this ability it allows him to get all of Heracles' goodies and strength.

Explanation of Samuel's power.

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Samuel power explanation 2

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In this state he's resistant to Ryu Blood Needles.

Resistant to Ryu Blood Needles

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Dropping Hydra

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Tanks multiple strikes from Gendoowun at 30%

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He blocked Clone Yeoui's strike with the Staff Of Apollon and parried it (The real Yeoui can extend at ftl speeds)

Blocks and parries Clone Yeoui with the Staff of Apollon

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He can consistently stop clone Yeoui in his grip.

Catchesclone Yeoui and stops it from expanding again - Album on Imgur

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Can block Yeoui even in it's giant form

Catches and uses clone Yeoui against Hui.

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He can summon the real Bow Of Hercules

Summons the real bow of Hercules

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Mubong says that if Mori Hui blocks the shot's from the Bow Of Hercules with Clone Yeoui it will break.

The bow of Hercules can break clone Yeoui

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The arrows are also covered with Hydra venom (Yeah for some reason Yamato-No-Orochi is the Hydra that Hercules defeated) which is Hercules weakness, and was powerful enough to knock Mori Hui out of his Monkey King state.

The poison from the arrow is enough to turn Hui back into his human form.

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17 years later when he becomes an Executive he's become even stronger.

He can pick up half of the real Yeoui.

Post-ragnarok Samuel picks up half of the real Yeoui.

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The real full Yeoui is heavy enough to destroy a dwarf planet.

Uriel in her phase 1 form can momentarily stop Mars from crashing into Earth at FTL speeds.

Uriel lifts Nars for a bit in Phase 1

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But was unable to hold the real Yeoui in her stronger Phase 2 form.

Uriel in phase 2 fails to hold real Yeoui.

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So Yeoui is heavier than Mar's mass multiplied by ftl speeds.

Samuel held half of that.

And he can shoot this giant arrow so good its trajectory changes mid-flight.

Samuel shoots arrow

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And this is without the feats from Ryong. Because Ryong was pushing Daewi's shit in, who is multi-planetary. And Samuel took hits from Ryong and didn't die.

Xhominid The Fool said:
Saber Ibuki Douji's fragmented version of her Noble Phantasm can create 8 valleys and 8 lakes which would virtually be Country level right there and that's not counting if that's the actual True Name Release or not.

Kyoichi feats.

He has the Yamato no Orochi sealed inside of him and wields the three Regalia's of Japan.

First is the Yata Mirror which can be used as a shield.

Even after being damaged it can block this

Power of Yata Mirror

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He also has the Kusanagi No Tsurugi inside of him, after summoning it he was able to injure Dante(Clone of Okhwang) with a single slash and destroy a forest.

However, the most dangerous part is that Kyoichi can summon Yamato no Orochi from the wound xenomorph style, meaning that if Ibuki is cut, she's gonna be meeting her father in the worst way possible. Yamato No Orochi is also capable of making giant explosions.

Power of Kusanagi no Tsurugi

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When using his full power he can cut Subject M a human-modified with the DNA of the Monkey king wearing Clone Yongpyo(Dragon Armorsuits) with Venom Bite. The real Dragon Armorsuits have multi-planetary durability.

He can summon snakes to trap opponents.

He can also summon Yamato No Orochi from the ground.

At its full size, it coils around clone Yeoui which towers over a city.

He also has a spell called Murder of Crows which allows him to summon crows that explode when he says destroy.

He has a spell called Snake Egg which is also a defensive spell.

He has survived this attack by Mira.

At 50% he can block a strike from M and send him into a building.

Kyoichi 50% - Imgur

With the addition of a spell, he sends M flying.

Sends Subject M flying - Imgur

He carves a giant groove into the earth, slices through the Dragon Armorsuits, and cuts M in half.

Kyoichi's Giant Slash - Imgur

He moves incredibly fast to M's position, stabs him, summons Orochi from M's body, and has it eat him.

Kyoichi summons Yamato No Orochi - Imgur

He slices through the clones

Kyoichi massacres M's clones - Imgur

He can fight with a chunk of his body gone.

Kyoichi fighting with chunk of body gone. - Imgur

At 80% he uses some sort of spell to destroy all the other M clones and damage the real M

Kyoichi kills clones - Imgur

With Ghost Slash, he penetrates the armorsuits but was unable to cut M's skin.

Ghost Slash - Imgur

AT 90% he can summon Orochi from himself, these snakes can grow large enough to tower cities, and are resistant to acidic material (M's flesh is acidic enough to melt stone in an instant.)

Kyoichi summons Yamato No Orochi from himself - Imgur

Also here's another feat of Kyoichi summoning Orochi

Kyoichi summon Orochi again

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Also, his poison should be the same as the one that Samuel uses. Since Yamato No Orochi is the same as the Hydra Herc defeated.

He can use the full power of Kusanagi No Tsurugi 17 years later.

And can pick up half of the real Yeoui.

Kyoichi picks up half of Yeoui

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Xhominid The Fool said:
Iskandar can canonically fight Altera on equal ground who is was compared to a Dragon at first which are Country Busters

Alexandros Feats

Can summon a phalanx

Can summon a Phalanx

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Equals Daewi's The Fist Of The Black Turtle and blitzes him from his blind eye.

Equals TFOTBT and blitzes Daewi from his blindspot

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Even after taking this much punishment from Mira he's unaffected and was about to summon Bucephalus before the Chinese team interfered.

Alex VS Mira - Imgur

Despite Dante being stronger, he had an advantage.

It should also be mentioned that Dante is way stronger than Subject M, to the point he gave M PTSD and defeated M with a single move.

Alex VS Dante

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He survives the same explosion that put a hole in the island by dodging, though not unscathed.

Alex dodges explosion and chakes Dante - Album on Imgur

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He chokes out Dante, reads his bluff, and gives another beatdown.

Alex VS Dante pt2 - Imgur

Dante shoots himself to get Alex off of him, Alex survives it.

Alex survives another explosion - Imgur

Fights equally with Dante despite at a disadvantage.

Alex VS Dante pt 3 - Imgur

He also survives being stabbed in the chest by Dante's hand, and a laser shot through his chest. Though he was unconscious, a simple Danmiku healing by Hui was enough to save his life and bring him back to consciousness.

ALex survives this - Imgur

He can summon a flying horse called Bucephalus.

Alex summons Bucephalus - Imgur

Xhominid The Fool said:
Berserker Jack The Ripper... well, I know you heard about him so it's obvious he basically murders here.

Gwim Gi

Knocks out Seungah Park in one hit.

Knocks out Seungah Park with one hit.

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Not affected by Ilypo's presence.

Not affected by Ilypo's presence

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Gwim vs Ilypo

Gwim vs Ilypo - Album on Imgur

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Gwim, Mandoek, and Bora vs a Priest.

Gwim, Mandeok, and Bora vs Priest Kim - Album on Imgur

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Gwim stabs a Nephilim.

Gwim stabs Nephilim

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Xhominid The Fool said:
Siegfried is seen as Karna's rival and is canonically stronger than Sieg-Fried whose only + was having Galvanism but could otherwise not even use the true power of Balmung and still did this:

With a Mana Burst enhanced Balmung Strike(No, this is NOT a True Name Release and he still created what is equivalent to Mountains from the sheer earthquake of the resulting strike). That's not forgetting the fact that again, he killed Fafnir... a Dragon so Country by default even before we get to him being seen as Karna's rival and Sigurd's equal which would knock him higher up.

Moon Ji-Joo's Feats

With a single slash of Walmung he can destroy a huge part of the city.

Moon uses Walmung - Imgur

He can use lightning that destroys a subway station.

Moon uses lightning - Imgur

He can heal people. His healing is good enough to heal a guy impaled by an arm.

Moon can heal people - Imgur

He's resistant to mind control.

Moon is resistant to mind control - Imgur

In his base he can survive this blast.

Moon blocks this attack in base - Imgur

He can use Walmung defensively.

Walmung can be used defensively - Imgur

He can summon armor that can block this blast.

Is capable of summoning armor strong enough to tank this beam - Imgur

Xhominid The Fool said:
And Lu Bu is capable of throwing down with Numerals Gawain, ala Saber Lancelot for an extended period of time and nearly drew with Cu in a fight to the death in CCC.

Mira's Feats

Mira cuts Saturn's gun.

Mira cuts Saturn's gun - Imgur

She can summon Toma, a flying red horse, which can outrun Saturn's grenade launcher.

Mira summons Red Horse - Imgur

She can cut a hole into a subway station.

Mira cuts a hole into a subway station - Imgur

When Mira was weakened Toma was unable to hold Mira, Daewi, and Mori.

When weakened Toma can't carry Mira, Daewi, and Mori - Imgur

Easily fights a teleporter.

Mira vs Teleporter - Imgur

Mira vs Saturn pt 1

Mira vs Saturn - Imgur

She can use Jeonbongchim x2

Mira uses Jeahbongchim x2 - Imgur

Mira vs Saturn pt 2

Mira vs Saturn pt 2 - Imgur

Despite being weakened she entered a trance and cut Saturn, clouds, and a mountain.

Enters trance and does giant slash - Imgur

She after being healed by the sacred tears and having taboo broken can hold back a Nephilim.

Mira holds back Nephilim - Imgur

Xhominid The Fool said:
Ruler Jeanne D'Arc is canonically stronger than her Archer version who can generate an Ocean as a by-product of her Noble Phantasm(Not her Noble Phantasm, just the byproduct).

Andre Oscar's feats

He wields the Rapier of Jeanne D' Arc

Wields the rapier of Jeanne D Arc - Imgur

He fights a puppet of Daewi han.

Oscar vs han pt 1 - Imgur

Wounds puppet Han at the same time Han punches him.

Oscar vs han pt 2 - Imgur

Tries to stab Han in his eye.

Oscar vs han pt 3 - Imgur

Oscar vs han pt 4 - Imgur

His Borrowed Power

Oscar's borrowed power - Imgur

He can summon a giant lance.

Lance Of Ages - Imgur

Borrowed Power ver 2 Witch Hunt can light the Lance on fire.

Oscar's borrowed power ver 2 - Imgur

Oscar vs han pt 5 - Imgur

He defeats Daewi.

Oscar defeats Han - Imgur

The Han that Oscar was a fake.

The Han Oscar fought was a puppet - Imgur

He fights puppet Mira quite well.

Oscar vs puppet Mira - Imgur

Survives P using Konami code.

P uses the Konami code - Imgur

Oscar is unaffected by the life-sapping power of the energy stones.

Oscar is unnaffected by the energy stone life sapping ability. - Imgur

Cryso Agori · Jan 11, 2022

Also, I'm kinda iffy on scaling Servants from stats and NP's of their other-selves.

Like Lancer Cu has A-ranked strength but Caster Cu has E in strength going by the wiki.

Cryso Agori · Jan 11, 2022

Oops, just realized that Alexandros's feats weren't properly posted, fixed it.

Flowering Knight · Jan 11, 2022

Cool feats, still gets bodied by bottom-tier Servants.

Xhominid The Apex · Jan 11, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Also, I'm kinda iffy on scaling Servants from stats and NP's of their other-selves.

Like Lancer Cu has A-ranked strength but Caster Cu has E in strength going by the wiki.

I'm gonna explain this one here a little better:
I'm not scaling Servants from stats or NPs, I'm scaling them based on who they stack to with other Servants and where they precisely fit to power wise with other NPs.

Jeanne D'Arc, for example, blocks 2 hits and takes an attack from Crying Warmonger Spartacus to the point it shakes the Hanging Gardens of Babylon like it's a violent Earthquake:

Chapter 3-8

Previous Page Next Page VOLUME 2 Chapter 3 Ch3-8 “Wha…!?” Even Ruler, who received knowledge concerning all Servants when she was summoned, couldn’t helped but be shocked by the appearance of what …

fateapocryphathetranslation.wordpress.com

Chapter 3-12

Previous Page Next Page VOLUME 2 Chapter 3 Ch3-12 Assassin of Red’s Fortress Noble Phantasm, Hanging Gardens of Babylon. Though on the battlefield, this fortress was the only place ruled by silence…

fateapocryphathetranslation.wordpress.com

Berserker of Red howled—and Ruler readied her holy flag, saying, “Come at me.”

Right before he swung down his gladius, Ruler repelled it with her holy flag. Two of his whip arms attacked her—and she blocked them both. But then, the third one, which had hidden behind them, swung at her—!

“Ugh, kuh—!!”

She received a direct hit. She was blown away and rolled across the ground. Luckily, the Dragon Tooth Warriors who had been ordered to kill her acted as cushions for her. In compensation for bringing her to a stop, a row of three of them was smashed apart; she would have flown to the edge of the battlefield if not for that. That attack technique been done through Berserker’s physical strength that was so great it was hard to believe and his prana that he had kept stockpiling.

No, perhaps the attack just now… shouldn’t be called a ‘technique’.

As she stood up, Ruler wiped blood from her lips. Ruler kept a backup of the body she was possessing—of Laeticia’s body. When she achieved her objective or if she was killed midway through the war, at that instant, Laeticia’s body would return to its original form as recorded in the backup and, depending on the situation, would be forcefully transported somewhere safe. With that process, no matter how many wounds this body received, it would immediately regenerate.

Therefore, it could be said there was no problem no matter how wounded she became, but… if she had received the blow just now while defenceless, she would have died.

When Shirou had carelessly talked to Caster of Red about his origins, Caster couldn’t help seeming as if he were about to spill over and fall from the gossip. Moreover, it was quite possible that he’d publish it as biography.

“Hmph. I am not so much of a fiend that I’d expose people’s privacy, but—whoa there.”

An impact ran through the ground beneath them from the bottom of the gardens. The whole gardens trembled violently as if affected by an earthquake.

“…That was?”

“The aftershock of Berserker’s attack, probably. It seems he’s about to reach his critical point.”

Assassin of Red ordered the Hanging Gardens to ascend higher in the air. It would be troubling if these gardens were targeted by that [weapon]. He should be targeting not these gardens, but the Fortress of Millennia.

“However—won’t the Holy Grail break as a result?”

“Have no fear. The Greater Grail is underground beneath the fortress, and it’s not something that can be turned into rubble anyway. Even if Berserker goes to attack it directly, there’s no problem. And in any case he no longer has such intelligence left in him.”

This is the same Jeanne D'Arc that in both mediums canonically is scared of Karna's presence and has to be bailed out by Siegfried:

This is despite the fact that in Fate/Extella she can take a Gate of Babylon Barrage and still live in spite of fighting Altera just seconds before:

AND the fact that even the most throwaway NPs Gilgamesh have is can effortlessly pierce through Mountains:

Fate/Zero:Act 10 Part 2 - Baka-Tsuki

www.baka-tsuki.org

The King of Heroes gave Tokiomi a glance of displeasure. Then he swung his right hand, which was propping up his chin on the edge of the ship. Four swords and spears appeared in the air next to him. The shining primeval Noble Phantasms unleashed a thunderous roar, and flew to impale the filthy mountain of meat that wriggled down below.

Saber and Rider reacted immediately and jumped away to avoid being caught in the attack, but Caster’s sea monster was in no ways so agile. The four Noble Phantasms hit it head on. Their power, enough to split mountains, blew one-third of the giant beast’s body into nothingness.

It was an unprecedentedly mighty impact, but Caster laughed out loud with an even more piercing sound.

Which is not only further collaborated on with Turas Realta of Okeanos:

But also in LB2 with the comparison to a Non-TNR weakest version of Gram/Balmung piercing through a barrier equivalent to a Fortress made of Divine Steel)

This is the same stuff that simple shield made of the Stuff is basically impossible for Napoleon Bonaparte as an Archer to even dent.
That's the BASELINE of Noble Phantasms worth a toss that isn't weak as hell in terms of the things they can easily tear through and the power they wield and the Servants who would very easily surpass Jeanne D'Arc at her physical strongest and I haven't even getting to the most ridiculous shit yet.

Basically it's like Flowering Knight would tell you: They would get bodied by everyone here.
And virtually all of these Servants listed would be Planetary due to Textures stuff and how strong their full power is and their standing.

Cryso Agori · Jan 11, 2022

Xhominid The Fool said:
Basically it's like Flowering Knight would tell you: They would get bodied by everyone here.
And virtually all of these Servants listed would be Planetary due to Textures stuff and how strong their full power is and their standing.

Jeanne is planetary?

I feel like everyone just looked over the lifting Yeoui feat but okay.

Then we use the current versions of GOH characters if they get stomped by the Fate characters.

Samuel was able to fight Ryong for a bit, the same Ryong that was stronger than Daewi, whose stronger than 17 years ago during Ragnarok. And during Ragnarok Daewi was multi-planetary, Daewi easily defeated Zeus who should be a planet buster scaling to Odin and hanged with Satan for a bit.

Also, Samuel has Hydra venom Herc's weakness.

Current Mira has Wi-fi which would allow her to use other people's borrowed power and Tam and should have multi-planetary AP herself.

Unfortunately, I don't know if Kyoichi or Oscar gets any new feats.

Uoruk · Jan 11, 2022

Everyone on the GoH side gets bodied even if you use current versions outside of Mira who would then slap her opponent

Cryso Agori · Jan 11, 2022

Uoruk said:
Everyone on the GoH side gets bodied even if you use current versions outside of Mira who would then slap her opponent

Nah, again Yeoui scaling.

Both Kyoichi and Samuel picked up half of the Real Yeoui.

(http://imgur.com/a/fvjJtZB)

(http://imgur.com/a/6ofCdkR)
Mori expanding real Yeoui was enough to break a dwarf planet.

And after Daewi accidently uses Planet toss Uriel in her phase 1 form was able to hold Mars for a bit.

(http://imgur.com/a/jXqLbNT)

Her arms snapped trying to hold the real Yeoui in her stronger phase 2 state.

(http://imgur.com/a/dXFrUzu)
And even if you don't believe that Samuel should win against Herc cause he fought Ryong and was only knocked out.

The same Ryong who was beating the shit out of Daewi, whose way stronger than his Ragnarok self and his ragnarok self caused Mars to nearly crash into earth accidently and had fought Maitreya Mubong after he had defeated Satan.

Uoruk · Jan 11, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Nah, again Yeoui scaling.

Ive read the series

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Both Kyoichi and Samuel picked up half of the Real Yeoui.

Which doesnt mean anything

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Mori expanding real Yeoui was enough to break a dwarf planet.

Yes. Which doesn't mean its it's physical weight that causes them to break

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
And after Daewi accidently uses Planet toss Uriel in her phase 1 form was able to hold Mars for a bit.

(http://imgur.com/a/jXqLbNT)

Her arms snapped trying to hold the real Yeoui in her stronger phase 2 state.

Yes

Doesn't mean it's weight is what break planets. Otherwise any planet it's been on would just crumble.

You're also trying to scale someone who's only picked up half of Yeoui to someone who had to endure the entire of it. That's not how scaling works.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
(http://imgur.com/a/dXFrUzu)
And even if you don't believe that Samuel should win against Herc cause he fought Ryong and was only knocked out.

Not saying much. Herc is one of the stronger servants himself which means he already outclasses Rosinante. Couple that with needing to get past Hercs defenses as well as kill him multiple times (each time needing to kill him a different way) he doesn't win at all. For someone with a Nanaya ava you seem to have limited knowledge of Fate/nasu

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
The same Ryong who was beating the shit out of Daewi, whose way stronger than his Ragnarok self and his ragnarok self caused Mars to nearly crash into earth accidently and had fought Maitreya Mubong after he had defeated Satan.

Planet Toss has nothing to do with physical strength so Ryong physically beating Daewi doesn't mean anything. The only person here who has a legitamate chance against their opponent is Mira if you use her current self who would most likely body Lu Bu because TAM is busted. It might work on a few more peeps on the list too

Xhominid The Apex · Jan 11, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Jeanne is planetary?

Yes. I can prove that with 2 points that happened in Apocrypha and in Mortallis Stella Manga:
1. In her fight against Amakusa, while she ultimately does lose the struggle, she explicitly was almost about to overload the Greater Grail with La Pucelle while Amakusa was using it in tandem with his Noble Phantasm to stop her attack from destroying it and him

And remember that in FGO, Greater Grails was explicitly used by Goetia in his Incineration of Human History plan and can change the entire History completely(Which was why Amakusa's wish was so dangerous as it would most likely become a Discarded Timeline in hindsight like Shimousa).
Edit: I keep believing a discarded timeline is a Lostbelt when a Lostbelt is an entirely different thing.

2. In Mortallis Stella, Gilles De Rais summons the Gigantic Horror again(AND combined it with the Greater Grail) and nothing could even do damage against it including TNR Balmung combined with George's Noble Phantasm to defeat it nor Elizabeth's Noble Phantasm combined with Amadeus's to weaken it as well.
Jeanne D'Arc completely obliterates it with La Pucelle which means it fits it's EX Rank.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
I feel like everyone just looked over the lifting Yeoui feat but okay.

I haven't really again, Servants are actually a hell of alot more powerful than people think they are which is due to actually going in and looking back and using FGO and later series for extra evidence.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Then we use the current versions of GOH characters if they get stomped by the Fate characters.

They would still lose. I'm pretty sure that none of the recent GOH characters are Planetary-Large Planetary like these characters are.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Samuel was able to fight Ryong for a bit, the same Ryong that was stronger than Daewi, whose stronger than 17 years ago during Ragnarok. And during Ragnarok Daewi was multi-planetary, Daewi easily defeated Zeus who should be a planet buster scaling to Odin and hanged with Satan for a bit.

But as you said, that's a BIT, that doesn't mean he's on his level nor would he get that scaling.
And again, the Servants here are easily Planetary but again, that's not where their max is.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Also, Samuel has Hydra venom Herc's weakness.

That only takes away all of his lives and Heracles is surprisingly cognizant and can easily react to EMIYA's Caladbolg II and Gilgamesh's GoB when they are actually a threat. Good luck with actually hitting him with that and him not just splattering you or being Heracles, sticking around and killing him anyway.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Current Mira has Wi-fi which would allow her to use other people's borrowed power and Tam and should have multi-planetary AP herself.

Lu Bu kills her before that happens lol. Again, he fought against Numerals Gawain for a given period of time in Fate/Extella:

And Karna literally says he can hold him off, the same Karna that is compared to Gawain CCC by BB. And that's not forgetting in that same game, Cu and Lu Bu was ultimately gonna kill each other off. And that's the same Cu that can hold off Gilgamesh for 12 hours and even give him a bad wound before he died.

And remember, Gawain took a Rhongomyniad pointblank WITHOUT his Numerals active and LIVED:

And while this is a fraction of Rhongomyniad's power, this is how strong Gray's SEALED Rhongomyniad is:
Case Files – volume one – chapter five – part three said:

No, that wasn't quite right. The heroic, noble magical energy pouring off of it made it clear that this was not just a spear. It was on a completely different scale. It was like a tower standing at the end of the world, a crystallized Mystery proving that countless legends, countless myths, were true.

It was the end of the story.

The accursed yet divine spear, decorating the end of the legend of King Arthur.

Softly, the true name of that weapon left my lips.

" Rhongo—( The Spear Shining—) "

The time had come.

The divine spear warped and shuddered.

Unable to resist the vortex of swirling magical energy, the Castle of Separation shook as if in fear. Though it was built only to respond to waves of sound, the sheer amount of magical energy was forcibly drawing a reaction out of it. The manifestation that drew in all mana from the surrounding environment was like disaster incarnate.

The Thirteen Promises hadn't been released yet, so it was still only a small fraction of its full power peeking through. Even so, that small fraction was on the level of Divine Spirits, something magecraft couldn't hope to match.

That level of magical energy, concentrated to the absolute limit, could be felt like an extreme heat. It felt like I was sticking my hand into a volcano.

Ashbourne's beast would not make it in time.

There was no way it could. The manifestation in my hands was a Noble Phantasm exceeded only by Excalibur( The Sword of Promised Victory) itself. The divine spear wielded by King Arthur against his mortal enemy, Mordred.

" —myniad( —At the End of the World) !!!"

Who could even see that spiraling light?

Even though it was night, it was as if the Sun had suddenly risen—as if a piece of the Sun had fallen down amongst them, a brilliant crimson spiral. The magical energy, and even the water vapour that hung in the air were burned and boiled away, the flash of light from the Age of Gods riding forth like a mounted tyrant.

Gouging out the spire above, the light pierced through the Castle of Separation's domed roof and castle wall, only stopping when it bit deep into the hillside beyond the castle.

So yeah, that's the power Lu Bu would have to deal with as Numerals Gawain is bullshit in and of himself to the point Musashi Berserker doesn't even want to fight him(Despite again, being able to conjure an Ocean as the byproduct of her NP like Summer Jeanne).

The only person who would probably win is the guy against Berserker Jack and that's due to how his Noble Phantasm works and even he has some bullshit.

Xhominid The Apex · Jan 11, 2022

Uoruk said:
Not saying much. Herc is one of the stronger servants himself which means he already outclasses Rosinante. Couple that with needing to get past Hercs defenses as well as kill him multiple times (each time needing to kill him a different way) he doesn't win at all. For someone with a Nanaya ava you seem to have limited knowledge of Fate/nasu

I want to lay this out to you because LB5.1 basically destroyed any chance of this being fair:

Heracles took TWO of these before he died:

Now you'll point out "The Casters buffed him to Kingdom Come so that accounts for something right?!" Wrong:

The Nautilus was reinforced with so many barriers, it was stated to be world breaking Magecraft barrier in Human History!
Upon noticing Artemis getting ready to fire on them, they literally allocate all resources into barriers:

All 60 of them AND a spatial distortion spell for good measure:

What happens the second that beam hit the Nautilus?

All of them was immediately destroyed and the Spatial Distortion spell was absolutely wrecked and barely held at that.
It ultimately took an immediate Zero Sail(Slip out of reality) to save themselves and it STILL wrecked the Nautilus and knocked Nemo into a coma before that happened.

Hell, they even mentioned that the Zero Sail did more to protect them than the barriers did! And it STILL wrecked Nemo doing it at "manageable levels" right down to his Saint Graph.

Again Heracles took TWO of them before he died just like Artemis in Okeanos predicted.

Cryso Agori · Jan 12, 2022

Uoruk said:
For someone with a Nanaya ava you seem to have limited knowledge of Fate/nasu

I read the manga, I liked it, and the art was cool so I made it my avatar. My only knowledge of Fate is through anime, though I am reading the Fate/SN VN currently and up to Orleans on FGO.

Also, reread GOH, and I've changed my opinion on Samuel VS Hercules. Kyoichi and Samuel do fight Ryong but they don't do damage.

Uoruk said:
Planet Toss has nothing to do with physical strength so Ryong physically beating Daewi doesn't mean anything. The only person here who has a legitamate chance against their opponent is Mira if you use her current self who would most likely body Lu Bu because TAM is busted. It might work on a few more peeps on the list too

Though I very much disagree with this.

Are you saying that current Daewi isn't physically a planet buster?

Daewi all the way back in the Ragnarok Arc was able to fight against Satan and the rest of the Gods who are planet busters.

And Satan scale's above Ardun, who in chapter 152 was going to casually smash the Sage Realm, which is a rocky planet bigger than Jupiter, and nearly cut it in half while fighting against Mori and cutting Yeoui in his fight with him.

Plus, Satan also broke Yeoui in half casually, with gives him large planet+ striking power anyway.

The Satan that Maitreya Mubong fought was even stronger.

Currently, Daewi was able to fight and wound Maitreya Mubong in chapter 482, the same Mubong that defeated the stronger Satan.

Ryong went and fought Mori afterwards who also has casual planet busting power since he was able to fight and wound Maitreya Mubong while also wounding Satan while sparring with his recoilless attacks. Ryong took Mori's attacks like a champ and wasn't wounded at all, Deer states afterward that Ryong could've probably defeated Mori.

Daewi, by the end of the fight with Ryong was breaking his body and learned how to use infinite punch. Which broke his thousands hands defense. Maitreya Mubong had to pull out infinite barrier to block it.

Xhominid The Fool said:
Lu Bu kills her before that happens lol. Again, he fought against Numerals Gawain for a given period of time in Fate/Extella:

And Karna literally says he can hold him off, the same Karna that is compared to Gawain CCC by BB. And that's not forgetting in that same game, Cu and Lu Bu was ultimately gonna kill each other off. And that's the same Cu that can hold off Gilgamesh for 12 hours and even give him a bad wound before he died.

And remember, Gawain took a Rhongomyniad pointblank WITHOUT his Numerals active and LIVED:

And while this is a fraction of Rhongomyniad's power, this is how strong Gray's SEALED Rhongomyniad is:
Case Files – volume one – chapter five – part three said:

So yeah, that's the power Lu Bu would have to deal with as Numerals Gawain is bullshit in and of himself to the point Musashi Berserker doesn't even want to fight him(Despite again, being able to conjure an Ocean as the byproduct of her NP like Summer Jeanne).

The only person who would probably win is the guy against Berserker Jack and that's due to how his Noble Phantasm works and even he has some bullshit.

Mira scales above the gods who are planet busters due to fighting an unhinged Daewi.

And current Mira is able to wound Maitreya Mubong which puts her at above large planet level.

How Ftl is Lu Bu? Cause Mira scales to MFTL.

Mori Dan currently is stronger than his ragnarok self despite losing his Monkey King powers.

In Ragnarok Satan punches Mori all the way to the sun in less than a second and keeps up.

Then Mori and Satan fight across the surface of the sun.

Maitreya Mubong was able to smash Mori into the moon so hard it broke and so fast it looked like Mori teleported and Mori who was able to keep up with Satan was unable to track that.

Then Maitreya Mubong fights a stronger and faster Satan that has trained from Ragnarok.

And Mira’s able to keep up with Maitreya Mubong.

So unless Lu Bu is pulling a Saint Seiya and crossing galaxies in seconds he’s not blitzing Mira.

Also doesn’t trying to go Ftl damage servant’s saint graphs? And that even in the Moon Cell it was only possible through the Mythic Mystic Code?

shade0180 · Jan 12, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
In Ragnarok Satan punches Mori all the way to the sun in less than a second and keeps up.

No one scales to that Satan and Mori.

Literally the current arc told us that the current arc Mori and everyone else is weaker than Satan and Mori that fought.

So stop using them as a scale.

Xhominid The Apex · Jan 13, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Mira scales above the gods who are planet busters due to fighting an unhinged Daewi.

And current Mira is able to wound Maitreya Mubong which puts her at above large planet level.

Apparently no one scales to them so I will ignore that...

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
How Ftl is Lu Bu? Cause Mira scales to MFTL.

Lu Bu is FTL because of Dead Corpse Edgemiya reacted to Meltryllis when she was FTL and put his cable on her... which he only did AFTER she did that(as well as Tristan since he was went down there with him).

And don't say "Well he must have stuck the cable BEFOREHAND" because everyone would have noticed that including Meltryllis.
Everyone stacks to FTL due to that feat alone.

Still going to ignore the other parts for the same reason as the above

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Also doesn’t trying to go Ftl damage servant’s saint graphs? And that even in the Moon Cell it was only possible through the Mythic Mystic Code?

Um yeah, you got both of those mixed up which I don't blame you since GaRbs and Siriel... love to downplay Fate when it becomes convenient for them(Siriel especially, GaRbs just doesn't know shit).

Meltryllis explicitly notes here that while the operation takes 2 and a half hours in real time, SE.RA.PH. took 10 days to do.
Remember that Meltryllis actually did this TWICE as it was mentioned in the end as she explicitly went FTL to go back 3 hours and started the whole thing over like Tristan mentioned when BB explained the mechanics:

Meaning that not only did Meltryllis do that successfully, but it took her 10 days and THEN doing it again for her to actually be destroyed.
Going FTL for a Servant isn't the problem, it's going FTL for a long distance that's the problem. It's the same fashion that a Servant using an Authority will injure them but it's not guaranteed death unless they overuse it like Dioscuri shows in LB5.2.
Because remember, Meltryllis had to go that fast in the first place to escape Kiara's allure which was the equivalent of a Black Hole and acting EXACTLY as such which most likely would have added to further pressure.

And in CCC, the Myth outfit wasn't done due to the FTL deal, it was because of how BS Kiara was at that point in time and it was never essential in dealing with FTL as the characters never use it at all to return back.
Hell, Nero actually DECLINES using it in Extella because it wouldn't make a damn difference against Altera despite wielding 1/3rd of the Moon Cell's power in the Regalia which heavily implied(and is obvious with how bad CCC Kiara was gimped AND gimping herself) the Myth MC didn't really do shit in context or execution against her.

Uoruk · Jan 13, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
I read the manga, I liked it, and the art was cool so I made it my avatar.

Oh? Why don't you post what scan that pictures from

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Though I very much disagree with this.

Are you saying that current Daewi isn't physically a planet buster?

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Daewi all the way back in the Ragnarok Arc was able to fight against Satan and the rest of the Gods who are planet busters.

.........

Buddy, he fought them with Okhwang's powers and even then he didn't inherit his body so no, he wasn't physically (as in raw strength) a planet buster then or even now.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
And Satan scale's above Ardun, who in chapter 152 was going to casually smash the Sage Realm, which is a rocky planet bigger than Jupiter,

You have no idea what size Oraeguk is. Don't pull shit out of your ass. Also moot point for reasons stated above.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Plus, Satan also broke Yeoui in half casually, with gives him large planet+ striking power anyway.

Satan yes.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
The Satan that Maitreya Mubong fought was even stronger.

And? literally irrelevant.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Currently, Daewi was able to fight and wound Maitreya Mubong in chapter 482, the same Mubong that defeated the stronger Satan.

Yes, because after 17 fucking years of learning to use Okhwang's power he finally succeeded in bringing out it's full potential with briefly amused mubong

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Ryong went and fought Mori afterwards who also has casual planet busting power since he was able to fight and wound Maitreya Mubong while also wounding Satan while sparring with his recoilless attacks. Ryong took Mori's attacks like a champ and wasn't wounded at all, Deer states afterward that Ryong could've probably defeated Mori.

completely irrelevant to this thread dude

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Daewi, by the end of the fight with Ryong was breaking his body and learned how to use infinite punch. Which broke his thousands hands defense. Maitreya Mubong had to pull out infinite barrier to block it.

Again, with use of Ok's power

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Mira scales above the gods who are planet busters due to fighting an unhinged Daewi.

No. She scales above them because R gave her TAM which meant she got Okhwangs physical power as well as the other gods he had absorbed

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
And current Mira is able to wound Maitreya Mubong which puts her at above large planet level.

She already was

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
-snip-

You and AM keep saying this shit.

No one in GoH is MFTL(Massively)

The highest calc they have in the OBD is a few times ftl at best. They're Marginally Faster Than Light

Type-Rey · Jan 13, 2022

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
Also doesn’t trying to go Ftl damage servant’s saint graphs?

It's much simpler than it seems.
Yes, going FTL damages SG's but that's not really different to any other attack/mode in fiction where a character fucks up their body to temporarily go above their limits.

Also, this is only applies for Travel over large distances as Xhom said and not to (and this is an important distinction that everyone who downplays the verse purposefully omits ) their reaction speeds, so unless we're talking about a long race...it's a moot point.

Thegoldenboy2188 said:
And that even in the Moon Cell it was only possible through the Mythic Mystic Code?

Moon Drives in Extella literally allows people to attack at LS without any damage or Mystic Codes, so no.

Cryso Agori · Jan 16, 2022

Sorry for taking so long to respond, I was collecting feats.

Uoruk said:
Oh? Why don't you post what scan that pictures from

Sure
blob:https://mangadex.org/36cc38e5-606e-4ca6-8a12-8292cd3f6270

Uoruk said:
Yes. Which doesn't mean its it's physical weight that causes them to break

Yeoui's entire thing is that it weighs so much that almost nobody can wield it.

Like Mori in the same arc where both Kyoichi and Samuel picks up Yeoui was so bad at controlling Yeoui's weight that he accidentally wipes nearly everyone during the Battle World event.

(http://imgur.com/a/FWNEeHP)

shade0180 said:
No one scales to that Satan and Mori.

Literally the current arc told us that the current arc Mori and everyone else is weaker than Satan and Mori that fought.

So stop using them as a scale.

No actually, I don't think current arc Mori is weaker than his Ragnarok counterpart.

I don't know why people seem to overlook this but the fight between Mori and Maitreya Mubong starts with Mori stomping Mubong.

(http://imgur.com/a/j2GDta4)

Literally puts the fear of God in him until Mubong remembers he's God and blitzes him.

(http://imgur.com/a/A8Ma9lt)

And this Mori was tracking Mubong, Satan, and Odin while they fight.

All of them are even stronger and faster than their Ragnarok counterparts who already move FTL.

Plus

Mori after realizing how to use recoilless was ripping apart the dragon armorsuits.

(http://imgur.com/a/fUWU6mW)

Which have planetary defense feats from the fight with Okwhang.

And have only been pierced by high-tier weapons or Gods, like Ardun's Sun Wheel, Blade of Tathagatha, and Bell of Agonies.

And afterward, though Satan was weakened from Mubong stealing his heart and wings Mori managed to cut Satan with his kicks multiple times.

(http://imgur.com/a/xagrEv0)

So yeah, I do think Mori is stronger than his Ragnarok self, even if his physical body is weaker, current Mori's techniques bridge the gap enough for me to say this in confidence.

There's also the what the Dragon King says.

Uoruk said:
Buddy, he fought them with Okhwang's powers and even then he didn't inherit his body so no, he wasn't physically (as in raw strength) a planet buster then or even now.

Ooooh. I think know what you mean now.

Yes, Daewi's body physically wasn't up to planet-busting power. but the Sage's Wisdom amped his strength+ he can use the Sage's Wisdom to control forces to amp his strength up even more.

Like even if you don't take his fight with Satan as evidence the fact that he was able to break Micheal's swords, made Beezulbub bleed and survive a full-on beatdown from the gods and get back up like nothing happened to fight the Unknown.

But current Daewi is 100% a planet buster in physicals with the Sage's body he got from Mira.

When Mori fought Ryong, he wasn't even able to damage him in his base form despite using recoilless.

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And Deer says that Ryong was strong enough to defeat Mori.

There's also these statements.

Ryong states that he and the other Disciples are above the 1st Heavenly Realm gods who are planet busters.

Ryong says that the Four Disciples are above the Gods

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Monkey states that Ryong is the strongest Disciple among them.

Monkey states Ryong is the strongest disciple

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And Deer states that Ryong has absurd defense.

Deer talks about Ryong's defense

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Daewi after gaining the Body of the king was strong enough to pressure and finally defeat Ryong with punches.

Chapters 509-516.

The God of High School - Ep. 509

Mori Jin is a high school student and Taekwondo specialist who enters "The God of High School," a fighting tournament that promises the winner anything they want. What began as a competition to seek out the best high school fighter soon reveals itself to be part of a much greater plot that goes...

www.webtoons.com

FInally getting to the important part Mira Yoo.

She currently wields the Blade Of Tathagatha. A blade made by Hephaestus, who also made the dragon armorsuits.

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And is powerful enough to pierce the Dragon Armorsuits.

She also was able to casually kill Gigantes, giant planet-sized beings.

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And fought Deer.

Chapters 493-495

The God of High School - Ep. 493

Mori Jin is a high school student and Taekwondo specialist who enters "The God of High School," a fighting tournament that promises the winner anything they want. What began as a competition to seek out the best high school fighter soon reveals itself to be part of a much greater plot that goes...

www.webtoons.com

From Ryong's statement the Disciples scale above the 1st Heavenly Gods. Some of whom are stronger than Ardun.

Ardun in the Sage Realm arc was going to destroy Oraeguk.

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Until Mori blocked it with Yeoui.

Before I said that Oraeguk is bigger than Jupiter.

Uoruk said:
You have no idea what size Oraeguk is. Don't pull shit out of your ass. Also moot point for reasons stated above.

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This is the largest size we've seen Yeoui grow, piercing through the moon to reach Earth.

The distance between the Moon and Earth is so long that you could fit every planet in the solar system between them.

Mori in the Sage Realm Arc, tries to save Oraeguk from the Sky Whale's explosion by making Yeoui expand.

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It only reaches up to the atmosphere.

This is consistent with how Yeoui is drawn on Oraeguk.

Chapters 149-160

The God of High School - Ep. 149

Mori Jin is a high school student and Taekwondo specialist who enters "The God of High School," a fighting tournament that promises the winner anything they want. What began as a competition to seek out the best high school fighter soon reveals itself to be part of a much greater plot that goes...

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So Yeoui which is large enough to reach the Earth from the Moon, is not large enough to send the Sky Whale out of Oraeguk's atmosphere.

Ardun was going to destroy it.

Deer is stronger than Ardun. And Mira defeated him.

Fate Characters fight their Charyeok users.

Luminous

Luminous

The Fighter

Luminous

Exceptional

Exceptional

Luminous

Luminous

Just a shadow

Luminous

Exceptional

Retired

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