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Masakado(smt) vs Prima (Transformers)
- Thread starter King
- Start date
idk
the tl;dr for Prima is despite having basically zero actual appearances he scales to everything in the main transformers multiverse, but not beyond that like Primus and Unicron do
the tl;dr for Prima is despite having basically zero actual appearances he scales to everything in the main transformers multiverse, but not beyond that like Primus and Unicron do
JayK
Illustrious
A heavily weakened Masako was already comparable to Demi-fiend.
Current is Lucifer/YHVH level as the sealing of Masakado was a decisive moment in the war between the armies of god and chaos.
Pegging order at the top as of V is Axiom > Stephen > Satan > Nahobino (Susano'o, Tsukuyomi) > Merged Lucifer > Lucifer = Masakado.
Current is Lucifer/YHVH level as the sealing of Masakado was a decisive moment in the war between the armies of god and chaos.
Pegging order at the top as of V is Axiom > Stephen > Satan > Nahobino (Susano'o, Tsukuyomi) > Merged Lucifer > Lucifer = Masakado.
Can prima scale immortality/durability like vector prime, if so I think a scenario like last time could be a draw but I could be wrong. @OtherGalaxy
yes, he's physically the same kind of being as Vector is. The original 13 Transformers are all of the same stock, and as Prima is superior to the rest anything Vector can do he should scale from. The only real difference is Vector is specifically connected to time and can't be killed if time exists at all, but the 13 also all exist outside of time and are immortal in that sense too.
JayK
Illustrious
To keep it as brief as possible.
The Mandala System was already mentioned in vanilla V and while its concept is still pretty bare bones we've at least got something to work with.
First of all one should know the following throne order:
Marduk (Horned God, Dragon Slayer) > Baal > YHVH > Nahobino
Probably also important to mention that dead Kagutsuchis are still floating around meaning we're still within the Amala Network.
Marduk slew the Primordial Goddess (Tiamat) and created the multiverse, including the Amala Network from her body. He also set the Mandala System in place. In vanilla it was explained to be akin to having a Nahobino as creator who then always gets overthrown by another Nahobino who then becomes the new creator. This supposedly should go on ad infinitum and would explain why even YHVH having banned all Nahobinos fell in the end.
In Vengeance the concept seems to go past that however as Mandala seems to concieve and repeat the same power struggle across realities (namely Cycles). At first I thought it might've just been universal scale shenanigans within the Amala Network but things just don't add up.
Independent of the ending you get Satan will appear, having retrieved Lucifer's and Samael's essences from alternate Cycles to physically manifest himself. That does not just imply there to be alternate reality Lucifers (which an alternate Nahobino slew, specifically mentioned by Satan even) and YHVHs (also meaning alternate Amala Networks and the by YHVH created multiverse) but also that even if you get the Vengeance Chaos ending in which you tear EVERYTHING down the Mandala System still stays in place despite everybody hoping that'd be the one thing to break it.
Satan hereby is also the only one staying the same among all Cycles. He also knows what happened in different Cycles as he as already mentioned retrieves the essences of some big players and tests the Nahobino whetever they are finally able to break Mandala this time (note the Nahobino never actually seems to defeat Satan in any Cycle).
There are alternate versions of Demi-fiend in every Cycle. Do I need to say more?
The Kiou Sword which after finding is outright stated to be taken to a different reality/timeline in which an ALTERNATE version of the Nahobino will face Masakado.
I am probably forgetting some more things but those are already heavy implications that Mandala encompasses all of YHVH's/Marduk's creation including Amala and serves to have the reality Marduk created persist forever.
The Mandala System was already mentioned in vanilla V and while its concept is still pretty bare bones we've at least got something to work with.
First of all one should know the following throne order:
Marduk (Horned God, Dragon Slayer) > Baal > YHVH > Nahobino
Probably also important to mention that dead Kagutsuchis are still floating around meaning we're still within the Amala Network.
Marduk slew the Primordial Goddess (Tiamat) and created the multiverse, including the Amala Network from her body. He also set the Mandala System in place. In vanilla it was explained to be akin to having a Nahobino as creator who then always gets overthrown by another Nahobino who then becomes the new creator. This supposedly should go on ad infinitum and would explain why even YHVH having banned all Nahobinos fell in the end.
In Vengeance the concept seems to go past that however as Mandala seems to concieve and repeat the same power struggle across realities (namely Cycles). At first I thought it might've just been universal scale shenanigans within the Amala Network but things just don't add up.
Independent of the ending you get Satan will appear, having retrieved Lucifer's and Samael's essences from alternate Cycles to physically manifest himself. That does not just imply there to be alternate reality Lucifers (which an alternate Nahobino slew, specifically mentioned by Satan even) and YHVHs (also meaning alternate Amala Networks and the by YHVH created multiverse) but also that even if you get the Vengeance Chaos ending in which you tear EVERYTHING down the Mandala System still stays in place despite everybody hoping that'd be the one thing to break it.
Satan hereby is also the only one staying the same among all Cycles. He also knows what happened in different Cycles as he as already mentioned retrieves the essences of some big players and tests the Nahobino whetever they are finally able to break Mandala this time (note the Nahobino never actually seems to defeat Satan in any Cycle).
There are alternate versions of Demi-fiend in every Cycle. Do I need to say more?
The Kiou Sword which after finding is outright stated to be taken to a different reality/timeline in which an ALTERNATE version of the Nahobino will face Masakado.
I am probably forgetting some more things but those are already heavy implications that Mandala encompasses all of YHVH's/Marduk's creation including Amala and serves to have the reality Marduk created persist forever.
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Thirteen prime
Distinguished
regarding its connection with time, it's probably something like The Fallen with its entropy, perhaps the Primes are the embodiment of a certain concept, both with time (Vector) and entropy/decay (The Fallen).
this is what I was thinking, we just haven’t been told what the others are connected to besides The Fallen and Vector
Thirteen prime
Distinguished
Well Prima is an archetypal hero (yes, it's from Aligned).
By the way, regarding Vector, he is probably also the one who makes the laws of physics and mathematics function, as stated in his biography, and in this same comic, at the very beginning, Vector states that each of the Primes performs a vital function of the multiverse, so in principle this fits.