[Toaru] Accelerator vs Niang-Niang

[Darth Zion]

Quote?

The standard concepts of space and time no longer have any meaning when Gugnir is thrown-

Her shout acted as a trigger.

Kamijou Touma and Othinus both moved at once.

It ended after one step.

A whirl of destruction burst out.

Time stopped.

Space was compressed.

The standard concepts of time and space no longer had any meaning.

Accelerator cannot block that. His reflection requires calculations which requires his time.

And while you can use this argument, taking a fight seriously doesn't make you any more durable

When did I say it would make her more durable?

 

[Paxton]

The standard concepts of space and time no longer have any meaning when Gugnir is thrown-


When did I say it would make her more durable?

How exactly is she going to be fighting differently to not get torn apart by an attack?

Quite frankly, and I've said it before: outside of one or two spells the spells Magic Gods use are genuinely underwhelming.
Their arsenal isn't that impressive.

 

[Darth Zion]

How exactly is she going to be fighting differently to not get torn apart by an attack?

By dodging it, by deflecting it with her weapons, by changing causality using sparks to ensure it never lands...

There are ways to stop an attack other than your body.

Quite frankly, and I've said it before: outside of one or two spells the spells Magic Gods use are genuinely underwhelming.

Yeah no, that's merely because we have only seen them use two or three spells.

Magic Gods have mastered their entire branch of magic and are above Index when it comes to magic. Othinus does not only have Gungnir and Phase manipulation, she knows all Norse Magic- same is the case far all Magic Gods.

 

[Paxton]

By dodging it, by deflecting it with her weapons, by changing causality using sparks to ensure it never lands...

There are ways to stop an attack other than your body.

Yeah no, that's merely because we have only seen them use two or three spells.

Magic Gods have mastered their entire branch of magic and are above Index when it comes to magic. Othinus does not only have Gungnir and Phase manipulation, she knows all Norse Magic- same is the case far all Magic Gods.

Here's a reminder that I'm referring to Nephthys, not Niang-Niang. The former is the one Accelerator actually fought, the latter is the person who he's fighting in the thread now.



We can't argue off of hypotheticals, unless there are relevant Egyptian mythology based spells in the series that would've helped her against Accelerator.

Anything beyond that is speculation.

 

[Darth Zion]

Here's a reminder that I'm referring to Nephthys, not Niang-Niang

Bro, the thread is about Niang-Niang.

 

[Paxton]

Bro, the thread is about Niang-Niang.

I know?

"And while you can use this argument, taking a fight seriously doesn't make you any more durable (although raw durability isn't particularly relevant for several reasons against him, but I digress)."

I was responding to you talking about Nephthys taking the fight seriously, which would've somehow changed the outcome of it.

 

[Darth Zion]

I was responding to you talking about Nephthys taking the fight seriously

Yeah, as @Churronzon showed- Nepthys had already countered his vector shield by disrupting his connection with Misaka Network.

She could have taken him out when he was unguarded right then and there had she been serious.

 

[Churronzon]

Is Accelerator's AIM spear esoteric enough to replicate Noukan's feat of killing Zombie or is it too speculatory?

 

[Paxton]

I don't see why not

 

[Darth Zion]

Is Accelerator's AIM spear esoteric enough to replicate Noukan's feat of killing Zombie

No, I don't think being esoteric has anything to do with negating a MG's regeneration.

Besides, it was not Noukan who killed Zombie and she was found death crucified on a cross with a vine of roses wrapped around her. That's Rosicrucian magic.

Unless you're talking about Zoukan killing High Priest.

 

[Churronzon]

No, I don't think being esoteric has anything to do with negating a MG's regeneration.

My point is I think Accelerator's attack is even more potent than what killed Zombie/High Priest.

Besides, it was not Noukan who killed Zombie and she was found death crucified on a cross with a vine of roses wrapped around her. That's Rosicrucian magic.

I love the Rosy Cross theory as much as the next guy, but I was just going with what Niang-Niang and Nephthys were telling the audience.
Noukan is described as playing a bullet hell when he was supplied with power from Aleister.

“That’s that golden retriever’s...A.A.A. was it called?”

“Oh? The thing that killed High Priest and Zombie?”

[...]

Kihara Noukan was still extraordinary for
heading out to the scene, accurately avoiding the downpour of fireworks-like blasts from
a bullet hell game, and fighting the boss all the while, but it was someone else who had
been supplying him his firepower from behind the scenes. In a way, one could say it was
that person who had killed High Priest and Zombie.
-NT17

The A.A.A is again stated to have killed the two magic Gods with Aleister's spell/power (Babalon spell or his esoteric willpower)

A.A.A.

Anti Art Attachment.

“I see.”

It was meant to be piloted by Kihara Noukan. While hiding in the Windowless Building,
Aleister had used that device to send her own magic elsewhere in order to kill the Magic
Gods.
-NT21

Rose cross is never mentioned as the cause of death, although it is a cool touch.

 

[Paxton]

Why would Aleister need the A.A.A. if the bastard already had a spell that let him kill Magic Gods?

 

[Churronzon]

A.A.A amplifies it.

Kinda how like Aiwass is an amplifier for Anna's will.

We don't know if Base babalon spell could do it on its own.

 

[Darth Zion]

Why would Aleister need the A.A.A. if the bastard already had a spell that let him kill Magic Gods?

Come on, Spritual Items amplifying the power of magicians is nothing new in ToAru.

It's a force multiplier. AAA without Crowley's magic is not enough to defeat Magic Gods- Misaka using it would not defeat Nepthys.

Noukan is described as playing a bullet hell when he was supplied with power from Aleister.

AAA is said to have killed the Magic Gods by amplifying Crowley's spell. Noukan entering the Hidden World is not mentioned anywhere-

Kihara Noukan was still extraordinary for heading out to the scene, accurately avoiding the downpour of fireworks-like blasts from a bullet hell game, and fighting the boss all the while, but it was someone else who had been supplying him his firepower from behind the scenes. In a way, one could say it was that person who had killed High Priest and Zombie.

It was meant to be piloted by Kihara Noukan. While hiding in the Windowless Building, Aleister had used that device to send her own magic elsewhere in order to kill the Magic Gods.

The closest interpretation we'd get is that that Crowley used a Rosicrucian spell, amplified it with AAA and then used it against Magic Gods.

I wouldn't exactly deny that AAA did not play a role in this but I don't see a normal spell doing much to MGs even if amplified.

My point is I think Accelerator's attack is even more potent than what killed Zombie/High Priest

My point is that Magic Gods keep their regeneration even after the nerf. It's not the potency that matters since they would just come back from their bodies being atomized.

The power being used against the MGs needs to have some property negating that factor. Accelerator negating Nepthys regeneration would work against MG but other forms of vector control would not put them down permanently.

 

[King]

Niang-Niang is Jiangshi lmao, she looks so ugly

 

[Churronzon]

Noukan entering the Hidden World is not mentioned anywhere-

Yeah Zombie was already in the regular human world. Why would Noukan need to enter the Hidden World? I certainly never mentioned that

My point is that Magic Gods keep their regeneration even after the nerf.

Which the AIM spear negates.

but other forms of vector control would not put them down permanently.

I never argued for anything other than the AIM spear. I didn't even bring up the drop of water > Niang-Niang; Pax did

Niang-Niang is Jiangshi lmao, she looks so ugly

 

[Darth Zion]

I certainly never mentioned that

My bad, I though you were talking about Crowley's fight with Magic Gods in the Hidden World.

Got confused since I'm having another argument with someone right now. I agree with you on that.

Which the AIM spear negates.

Sure, no arguments with that.

Niang-Niang is Jiangshi

That's the concept behind her design.

So the consensus seems to be that it comes down to who uses their best powers first- Niang-Niang can defeat Accelerator only through Sparks and Acceleration can only defeat her with his AIM spears. It's a question of who uses what first.

 

[Paxton]

Random question but can Niang-Niang fly? I don't recall.

Like, besides the spell all magicians have (but don't use).

 

[Churronzon]

With artificial flame booster thrusters, yeah. Idk how the other MGs would do it if they could.

Coronzon's flight speed seems to be a lot faster

 

[Darth Zion]

Random question but can Niang-Niang fly? I don't recall.

All magicians can- they never use it because practically everyone knows St. Peter's spell which negates flight.