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OBD Convo #58: We are the Heroes of Justice

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Feels like one of those people that blames a character like Shinji for reacting like a 14 year old would in Evangelion while also failing to acknowledge they’d be doing exponentially worse facing the trauma appearing on screen

Mark’s life sucks, his willpower to keep going forward is what his name is ultimately calling “Invincible” by proxy. He’s also got the moral rigidity expected of someone his age. He’s still working on discovering what grey looks like on a barometer that used to be solely black and white.
Nah shinji was a bitch
 
Wait, I haven't been keeping up, what show is this?

That's horrifying though :geg
Solo Leveling
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Wait, I haven't been keeping up, what show is this?

That's horrifying though :geg

Feels like an understatement if empathy is that underdeveloped :maybe
Posted a video here about a week ago of “worst anime protagonists” which included on the list Ganta Igarashi and Shinji for both reacting realistically like teenagers would to the traumatizing things they endured.
 
Posted a video here about a week ago of “worst anime protagonists” which included on the list Ganta Igarashi and Shinji for both reacting realistically like teenagers would to the traumatizing things they endured.
Might as well be titled "I'm already struggling in real life, I want power fantasy that doesn't remind me I'd suck harder"
 
Now you know how most of us felt seeing that garbage and hoping and praying they aren't adults but just chunni teenagers.
See, teenagers would be fine, if still silly

They're still developing emotionally. They're still playing around with different thoughts and ideas.

If you're still saying this shit in your mid 20s though, someone or something failed you spectacularly along the way :skully
 
Speaking of terrible, CBR made a list of the 20 best anime with the worst protags
:heston

20. Konosuba - Kazuma
From the start, Kazuma is nothing but rude, obnoxious, and lazy, hardly putting in any effort compared to the others. In fact, he's probably one of the most useless members of the party, aside from Aqua. His combined uselessness and annoying character traits make him hard for most fans to like, and even the biggest KonoSuba fans can't stand him.

19. Sailor Moon - Usagi
Usagi Tsukino isn't necessarily a bad character, but even the most devoted Moonies can admit that she's a pretty annoying heroine. She's a huge crybaby, especially at the beginning of the series, and a pretty big coward as well. If that isn't bad enough, she's pretty childish and even selfish throughout much of Sailor Moon. Though she's an iconic character, Usagi definitely has some glaring flaws as a protagonist.

18. Death Note - Light
By the series' end, he's gone from an anti-hero to a full-fledged villain, and some of his actions are so horrendous, they make him completely unlikeable. Now, years after Death Note's conclusion, many can't help but look back and despise Light for the many atrocities he commits throughout the series.

17. Naruto - Naruto
Even the biggest Naruto fans have to admit that as a kid, the titular hero is painfully obnoxious. With his childish antics, cocky attitude, and loud mouth, many early fans couldn't stand him. Luckily, Naruto improves a lot with age, and later on into Shippuden he's a much better character.

16. School Days - Makoto Itou
Many consider Makoto the true villain of the series, and it's not far off. After all, his selfishness and manipulative behavior destroy the lives of everyone involved with him. Throughout the series, he refuses to take responsibility for what he's done, and so, he pays the ultimate price. Makoto is undoubtedly the worst character in School Days, and absolutely no one is sad to see him go.

15. Black Clover - Asta
The most unique aspect of Black Clover's world-building is its adherence to the rules of magic. However, Asta is the one major exception. His lack of magic aggravates many of those around him. Unfortunately for fans, his constant screaming and yelling, especially in the series' dubbed version, evokes similar negative emotions.

14. Tokyo Ghoul - Kaneki
Kaneki endlessly bemoans his ghoulish affliction, but rather than use his incredibly overpowered Kagune, he crumbles under the pressure. Although the show's second season paints him in a more favorable light, its progress is immediately undone by the jumbled mess that is Tokyo Ghoul:re.

13. Deadman Wonderland - Ganta
Most people put in this situation would fold under the pressure if put in this situation. Rather than subvert audience expectations, Ganta falls apart, and his only saving grace is an unearned ability that suddenly manifests itself. The unoriginality of his character is quite possibly what kept this otherwise enjoyable series from being renewed for a second season.

12. Fairy Tail - Natsu
While Natsu is at the forefront of Fairy Tail's core events, many fans would argue that he is one of the least-developed characters in the series. His lack of depth and nuance prevents the show from becoming anything more than pure escapism.

11. MHA - Deku
Deku's boyish charm is by no means unenjoyable. But in a show that is pushing the boundaries of the genre in other regards, he feels uninspired. Luckily for fans, My Hero Academia will likely change their perspective on his character in the near future.

10. Inuyasha - Kagome
Throughout a good portion of the series, Kagome is deadweight for the group and constantly needs saving, a trait that annoys a lot of the audience. Though she goes through a lot of character development and is much stronger by the end, fans still consider her a bad protagonist.

9. AoT - Eren
Eren began as a young and hopeful man, fighting to protect those he loves. But as the series became grimmer, he became far more unlikeable. Eren commits some of the most atrocious acts of the series, making it harder for fans to support him. Though his reasons are understandable, the more he changes, the more fans wonder if he's a hero or a villain.

8. Tokyo Revengers - Takemichi
Takemichi's weakness shocks even the biggest Tokyo Revengers fans. While other shonen heroes can hold their own in a fight, Takemichi gets beaten down every time. For some, it's a refreshing change of pace. But for others, his lack of strength makes for a wimpy protagonist who fails to carry such a great series.

7. SAO - Kirito
Kirito is one of the most overpowered characters and is loved by nearly every female in the franchise, but he is still somehow void of any personality. While some SAO fans come to his defense, most will say that he's a boring self-insert character and that the series would be better without him.

6. DBZ - Goku
Goku is childish, selfish, and immature. He cares more about fighting and strength than anything — even more than his own family at times. He hardly develops, maintaining a selfish behavior that could even give Vegeta a run for his money. Dragon Ball is an amazing and iconic series, but its protagonist could do with some improvement.

5. Orange - Naho
Despite her efforts to change fate and save Kakeru, she is often much more passive than characters such as Suwa, who take a proactive role in helping him. Her weakness, indecisive nature, and lack of confidence are frustrating for the audience as she struggles to accomplish the simplest goals.

4. Pokemon - Ash
In almost every way possible, Ash has had no development and remains a bland protagonist who never ages, never gets stronger, and never wins. Though the anime revolves around him and his journey, he's one of the least interesting things about Pokémon. Luckily, now that the series is finally bringing his story to an end, there's a chance for improvement when it comes to the main protagonist.

3. Boruto - Boruto
Boruto is one of the least-liked protagonists out of the new generation, with most seeing him as bratty and spoiled. His attitude and harsh treatment of Naruto make the series hard to sit through for a lot of long-time fans. Many find the series much more enjoyable when the focus is on anyone but Boruto.

2. Re:Zero - Subaru
Despite its wild popularity, Re:Zero's protagonist Natsuki Subaru is hated by much of the fandom. Subaru suffers a similar fate as many isekai protagonists, having little personality and coming off more as a self-insert character. Many can't stand his weak, wimpy personality, seeing him as one of the least useful out of the main cast.

1. Evangelion - Shinji
Anime is famous for its strong, courageous main characters, and Shinji is none of these. He does nothing but cry and feel sorry for himself throughout the series. Even when Shinji is of use, he's nowhere near the hero that fans expect. Though his reactions to the pain and trauma in his life are understandable, they make the series hard to watch and even harder to enjoy.

:heston
 
Speaking of terrible, CBR made a list of the 20 best anime with the worst protags
:heston

20. Konosuba - Kazuma


19. Sailor Moon - Usagi


18. Death Note - Light


17. Naruto - Naruto


16. School Days - Makoto Itou


15. Black Clover - Asta


14. Tokyo Ghoul - Kaneki


13. Deadman Wonderland - Ganta


12. Fairy Tail - Natsu


11. MHA - Deku


10. Inuyasha - Kagome


9. AoT - Eren


8. Tokyo Revengers - Takemichi


7. SAO - Kirito


6. DBZ - Goku


5. Orange - Naho


4. Pokemon - Ash


3. Boruto - Boruto


2. Re:Zero - Subaru


1. Evangelion - Shinji


:heston
The only thing that list got right was Boruto being top 3 worst. School days protag deserved worse for being a genuine piece of shit.
 
My problem with Shinji is not that he reacts like a teenager to being a Mecha protag, my problem is the way the tv show ruined his character development, set him back to square one, and Anno refusing to give him a proper conclusion, ignoring everything else, making the movie more of a clusterfuck as a fuck you to fans because he was going through issues, and only after decades with the Rebuild films did he bother to give him any real ending which despite how much fanboys who think the original ending was "perfect" will bitch and whine about, is better than what he was given years ago.

I just rewatched First Blood and finally saw Part 2 for the first time and even outside of the ending of First Blood having John Rambo breaking down and crying from PTSD, the 2nd had him almost weeping over a girl he fell in love with dying. That's a grown ass man trained into being the most elite military unit of his time and even when he shows his emotions I have zero problems with. My problem is when the story refuses to have its character grow out of being a crybaby like with Deku who cries at the drop of a hat and the author pretends that's a good thing and not obnoxious and annoying. Losing a loved one, failing to save someone, losing your cool after too much stress accumulates, those make sense to cry about, doing it all the time is when it goes from "emotional" to just whiny.
 
Speaking of terrible, CBR made a list of the 20 best anime with the worst protags
:heston

20. Konosuba - Kazuma


19. Sailor Moon - Usagi


18. Death Note - Light


17. Naruto - Naruto


16. School Days - Makoto Itou


15. Black Clover - Asta


14. Tokyo Ghoul - Kaneki


13. Deadman Wonderland - Ganta


12. Fairy Tail - Natsu


11. MHA - Deku


10. Inuyasha - Kagome


9. AoT - Eren


8. Tokyo Revengers - Takemichi


7. SAO - Kirito


6. DBZ - Goku


5. Orange - Naho


4. Pokemon - Ash


3. Boruto - Boruto


2. Re:Zero - Subaru


1. Evangelion - Shinji


:heston

It's weird they keep using that reason for Kirito as if he's that egregious anymore in the recent years of OP as fuck MCs that are genuinely even moreso broken than Kirito is...
Also, where the fuck is Meliodas?!
 
Kirito is only as bad as he is because the anime fucked up the first arc by inserting a bunch of side stories to make him seem overpowered.

He literally always needs help bringing down the arc villain and as shit as the fairy arc is writing-wise the whole point of that story was that the idea of him being anything but a lucky kid good at video games is retarded af.

Kirito is a borderline deconstruction of the edgy loner "badass" character because things only ever work out for him when he lets people help
 
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