Shin Megami Tensei vs toaru

[Astaro]

I'm pretty sure he's saying each of those rubber bands themselves create infinite parallel worlds, hence at least megaversal.

That's what I'm assuming he's getting at.

Except from what I’m reading, the infinite parallel worlds are the multiverse

 

[King]

 

[Paxton]

Yeah I've seen this before and played Nocturne.

There's a Kagatsuchi (avatar) for each Vortex World, and there's an infinite amount of Vortex Worlds/Kagatsuchi's. Is that not just considered multi+?

 

[NostalgiaFan]

Since when and how?

If you seriously don't know who strong SMT is before talking on a topic about it, you should really refrain from doing so.

 

[Paxton]

Literally was just asking a question.

 

[Cryso Agori]

I still don't get where the idea that Virtual-On Othi pl is canon. I checked Baka-tsuki's version of the crossover and it contains nothing about Kamachi calling others fools for not believing that the powerlevels are canon.

Here's baka-tsuki's version by Js06

Toaru Majutsu no Index:Virtual On Afterword - Baka-Tsuki

www.baka-tsuki.org

Okay, this is Kamachi Kazuma!

You probably already know, but this story started as a dream project where we decided to do some kind of crossover between A Certain Magical Index and Cyber Troopers Virtual-On!! If you think there had to be something really twisted to how this got started, let me tell you I was shocked by the odd power of connections I felt when the offer first arrived. It made me wonder how big or small this industry is. It’s Virtual-On but there aren’t two levers? Where’s the jump cancel button? Why are they fighting over points instead of wearing down each other’s gauges? I’m sure a lot of you were asking those questions, but that’s because we prepared a whole new rulebook for this dream project instead of using the rules of the existing series. It might be surprising, but the overwhelming majority of these suggestions for “a different sort of Virtual-On” came from the Sega. …At first, I thought I should build up a world that strictly followed the Virtual-On side of things (and the more I looked into that, the more material I found to use), but when Watari-san saw the plot I had come up with, he sliced it in two and said I should do more of my own thing with it. I’m not sure how to explain what I felt then, but it really rattled me and reminded me that this was nothing like my usual jobs.

So I ended up basing the story on the Index side of things while having fun with the Virtual-On material I had.

If you asked me what my favorite Virtuaroids are, I would have to say Temjin or Fei-Yen. That might be cliché, but I think I may tend toward the ones with less idiosyncratic controls. That said, I’m a lot more interested in the Tangram than the Virtuaroids themselves. It chooses who to be with, it has incredible power but doesn’t show it off and usually hides in an extradimensional place, it gets all tsun-tsun and drives away any strangers who approach, and it only has a connection with L’Ln Plajiner who created it. That round thing sounds like a shy tsundere to me. Maybe what grabbed my attention was how it has such a clear character even though it’s inorganic(?).


I give my thanks to Watari-san and everyone else from Sega, to Katoki Hajime-san who not only designed the Second Plajiner and the other units but directly handled the illustrations as well, and to my editors Miki-san, Onodera-san, and Anan-san. I love wasting resources and talent like this. You often hear that the attention a book gets before release is important these days, but I think this should take care of that nicely. Thank you very much.

I also give my thanks to the readers. What did you think of this crossover that began as a dream project? I tried to keep things in the usual Academy City setting while bringing the battles to a scale I normally can’t use. I hope you enjoyed it.


And I will end this here.


I hope the prefix of “dream” can be removed someday.

-Kamachi Kazuma

Here's the version that Astaro got from Fiamma

At first, I thought I should build a world that strictly follows the worldview of Virtual-On (and the more I did that, the more material I had to use). However, when Watari-san saw the plot I had come up with, he told me to split it into two pieces and put more of my own ideas(toaru) into it. I don't know how to describe how I felt at that time, but it was a really big shock, and I realized that this work was different from what I usually do.

it's true that the collaboration is not an official event.
But for the fools who claim that it's not official settings at all, please convey this to them

All baka-tsuki's version talks about is Kamachi being told to add more toaru stuff into the story. It has nothing about Kamachi saying that its an official setting.

@fiamma would you mind posting the raw version of the afterword if you have it? Or at least sending me to somewhere I could find it?

 

[Mr.OMG]

Except from what I’m reading, the infinite parallel worlds are the multiverse

Isn't an infinite number of infinite multiverses a megaversal?

 

[Paxton]

I still don't get where the idea that Virtual-On Othi pl is canon. I checked Baka-tsuki's version of the crossover and it contains nothing about Kamachi calling others fools for not believing that the powerlevels are canon.

Here's baka-tsuki's version by Js06

Toaru Majutsu no Index:Virtual On Afterword - Baka-Tsuki

www.baka-tsuki.org

Here's the version that Astaro got from Fiamma



All baka-tsuki's version talks about is Kamachi being told to add more toaru stuff into the story. It has nothing about Kamachi saying that its an official setting.

@fiamma would you mind posting the raw version of the afterword if you have it? Or at least sending me to somewhere I could find it?

I have no say in the matter, but read the OP. It doesn't matter if it is or not.

"Allows use of non-canon feats"

 

[Astaro]

Isn't an infinite number of infinite multiverses a megaversal?

Yes.

Except all I see in that quote you posted (and the ones I’ve posted for Tangram) is an infinite multiverse

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

Literally was just asking a question.

1. You should know this considering people have told you this countless times including myself.
2. I also brought in it as how it's usually an issue for localizers not getting the correct essence for a statement.

Lost in Translation: Several, particularly the Japanese names for demon races (for example, the True Final Boss's race would be better translated as "Great Demon King" but is localized as the much simpler "Devil"). However, a prominently misleading case is "アマラ宇宙" localized as Amala Universe; while it is technically a correct translation, Amala is an expanse which contains multiple universes (billions in fact, according to the Lady In Black), so a more accurate translation would be "Amala Cosmos" or "Amala Space".

Demi-Fiend in what is virtually the canon route literally destroys Kagutsuchi so badly, he's irreversibly dead in all of the billions of Universes in the Amala Space. This is the same for the Nahobino, Aleph, Flynn and others due to them killing the fragments of YHVH who are also just that strong and ludicrous themselves.

That's why they have the Megaversal+ standing.

EDIT: This makes it even more clear and obvious

The Multiverse: Notable for being the first of the mainline Shin Megami Tensei-titled game which properly explores the concept instead of just vaguely mentions it. As the player ventures through the Labyrinth of Amala, the Lady In Black eventually explains the Vortex World is only a single world in the vast river known as the Amala Universe (a fairly misleading translation; see Lost in Translation), and whatever happens to this Vortex World does not affect billions of other universes in Amala; this makes it possible other games in the franchise are in fact part of this continuity. However, previous games (mainly Last Bible and Devil Children) having their own groups of universes suggest that the Amala is a multiverse (a group of universes), and not the multiverse (the entirety of Shin Megami Tensei franchise). Future games later reinforce this by showing they have their own versions of Void Between the Worlds or Place Beyond Time which connect their sets of universes, such as the Akarana Corridor (Raidou Kuzunoha continuity) and the Expanse (Shin Megami Tensei IV and Apocalypse).

 

[Masterblack06]

The Nahobino is even stronger considering he managed to beat a Lucifer that killed and absorbed the power of God and ascended to a higher realm of power beyond the level that God was at.

 

[Paxton]

1. You should know this considering people have told you this countless times including myself.
2. I also brought in it as how it's usually an issue for localizers not getting the correct essence for a statement.



Demi-Fiend in what is virtually the canon route literally destroys Kagutsuchi so badly, he's irreversibly dead in all of the billions of Universes in the Amala Space. This is the same for the Nahobino, Aleph, Flynn and others due to them killing the fragments of YHVH who are also just that strong and ludicrous themselves.

That's why they have the Megaversal+ standing.

EDIT: This makes it even more clear and obvious

"billions of universes"

"Megaversal+"

This is literally what I was just talking about.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

The Nahobino is even stronger considering he managed to beat a Lucifer that killed and absorbed the power of God and ascended to a higher realm of power beyond the level that God was at.

That is true but I was too lazy to bring it up since I wanted to explain why the protagonists are Megaversal


But yes, Nahobino is like the strongest Protagonist in the franchise... outside of the Game Gear Port of the first Last Bible where the protagonist literally fights the Great Will itself and gets it to stand down though he dies doing so

That's not getting into the THE Last Bible Series where a different protagonist in a SMT game literally became The Creator and was put down by the Protagonists in that game

 

[King]

The Nahobino is even stronger considering he managed to beat a Lucifer that killed and absorbed the power of God and ascended to a higher realm of power beyond the level that God was at.

Not to mention Stephen, who alone fought the five messiahs

 

[King]

Yes.

Except all I see in that quote you posted (and the ones I’ve posted for Tangram) is an infinite multiverse

each of YHVH's heads can sustain and destroy a Megaverses, Kagutsuchi is only a tiny fraction of him

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

each of YHVH's heads can sustain and destroy a Megaverses, Kagutsuchi is only a tiny fraction of him

Yes, in fact, it's heavily implied that what happened in SMTV was a FAILED attempt at a Conception. Meaning that Demi-Fiend killed it so badly, it completely fucked up a whole different megaverse altogether.

 

[Paxton]

each of YHVH's heads can sustain and destroy a Megaverses, Kagutsuchi is only a tiny fraction of him

Scan?

And no, Kagatsuchi isn't a fraction of YHVH, they're both fractions of the Great Will.

YHVH = / = the Great Will (which is likely a separate being from the Great Reason, idk, modern Atlus writing is a meme).

 

[Astaro]

each of YHVH's heads can sustain and destroy a Megaverses, Kagutsuchi is only a tiny fraction of him

Not a good look for you when you make a thread your this certain has an intended winner in mind

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

Game Gear port of The First Last Bible game has you straight up defeat/kill The Great Will itself and the 4 conceptual beings that make up Reality itself.



The final villain is basically a dude from a whole ass different series basically put on the same perch the Nahobino is in... and fucking killed him and took his place

Othinus gets fucked up.

 

[Paxton]

That's a bunch of word salad unless you actually quantify what they can do.