To Aru Majutsu No Index Feats/Discussion/Analysis Thread - One Othinus To Rule Them All
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Mr.OMG
Paramount
Btw. Quote from MisaMisa novel
But it's probably not canon, since even Kamachi said that even within the infinite multiverse the events of this novella are impossible/non-canon. Though I find the very fact that rubber string theory is used interesting. Kamachi also uses this concept in another of his works, in which one character creates an infinite number of parallel timelines, with all the possible "What If" possibilities
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Full Translation
Quote Kamisato about parallel world
This seems honestly to a philosophical thing rather than a full on explanation
Mr.OMG
Paramount
Honestly, it sounds like nonsense. It sounds like the AI took the quote about "not an infinite number of parallel worlds" and just wrote some philosophical text. It's not even close to the original lol
fiamma
Notorious
"Time is a one-way road. The past, present, and future are connected. Parallel worlds don't mean there are many worlds; it's just about which nail the rubber band of time catches on, on the board with countless nails. It's not that there are infinite parallel worlds. The 'many-worlds interpretation' is often misunderstood that way.
Just like there is a limit to the energy that constitutes the universe, the number of branches is naturally limited. That's why inconsequential choices, like 'which shirt to wear today' or 'what to eat for breakfast,' don't result in branches. Such minor fluctuations are smoothed out and absorbed by the flow of more significant, decisive choices.
If 'meeting you' was one of those significant, decisive choices, then the world where 'I didn't meet you' does not exist. There's no branch like that. Because I met you, we are here now. No matter how many times I would turn back time, the result would be the same; I would meet you.
It's said that the more significant the event, the more energy it has, and it becomes a 'nail' that definitely catches the rubber band. On the other hand, trivial events don't become nails; they're like dust, ignored by the rubber band of time. For example, the 'Red String of Fate' is not something that one can see, nor is it red.
The 'Red String' is just a metaphor. But it's true that there's a force that pulls certain people together, akin to gravity. This isn't just about romance. It includes the forces that bring friends together, that draw you to certain places, or even the events that lead to you picking up this book.
The force that draws people to each other might be tiny, like gravity. Invisible, but it's there. Perhaps, it could be said that this is the true 'Red String of Fate.' Something that can’t be seen with the eyes, yet undeniable. That's what ties you and me together.
And if you trace back that string, you'll find a massive, complex web, connecting not just people, but events, and even the world's destiny. All of it is linked together by countless strings. That's why even the smallest actions have meaning. They're all part of the vast, interconnected system.
Yet, this doesn't mean that every little action we take is significant in changing the world. Most are absorbed, inconsequential in the grand scheme. But sometimes, just sometimes, there's an action that seems insignificant yet ends up changing everything.
It's like a game of pinball, where the ball, at first glance, seems to be following a straightforward path, but then it hits a nail, changing its direction entirely. Even a small nail can cause a big change in the trajectory.
This is what is so terrifying and yet so wonderful about life. You never know which nail you'll hit next. It's unpredictable, and yet, that's what makes it worth living. The 'what ifs' and the paths not taken are what lead us to the present, the undeniable now.
Each choice you make is not just your own but is influenced by the countless connections and strings you cannot see. They guide you, sometimes subtly, sometimes more overtly. It’s all part of the intricate dance of existence.
The thought that everything could be different if only one tiny thing had changed can be overwhelming. Yet, embracing that everything you experience is the accumulation of all prior choices can give you a deeper appreciation for the present moment. It helps you realize the importance of now.
And in that realization, you find the courage to make choices that matter, to make changes that resonate through the web of life. That's how you create ripples, how you influence not just your own path, but potentially the paths of others across this vast, interconnected universe."
===================================
The translation is completely wrong. Although I'm not very familiar with English, I could tell at a glance that it was nonsense. The correct translation of that passage is as follows:
"Shincheonji."
The brown-haired boy said nonchalantly, crumpling the empty milk carton as if it were nothing.
"I heard that such a collection of dreams is in my right hand. Indeed, that's right. 'I think it was called the World Rejecter' or something like that."
"...It's impossible. Parallel worlds is..."
"Yeah. It's like attaching a rubber band to a nail-studded slingshot; in the end, it's just a single line. Parallel worlds don't exist infinitely. But at the same time, the world is like a rubber band. It's flexible, like time and space. The world we know has surprisingly a lot of excess - it's like using only 10 cuts out of a 60-cut film. Even if you borrow a couple of the remaining cuts and insert a different movie subliminally, no one would notice. You wanted it, didn't you? Even though you knew it was something that could never be achieved. But you still yearned for it. You 'Magic gods'."
"After investigating the ends of the universe and every overlapping phase, and realizing that there's nothing new left at all. But if such a thing were possible... To throw away all the annoying things of this world and spread your wings in a paradise that no one knows about..."
I am quite inexperienced in English, so my English relies heavily on Claude, Anthropic's AI assistant, and DeepL translator for a significant portion of the work.
Therefore, if there are any parts of my replies that are difficult to understand, I would appreciate it if you could point them out to me clearly and specifically.
Just like there is a limit to the energy that constitutes the universe, the number of branches is naturally limited. That's why inconsequential choices, like 'which shirt to wear today' or 'what to eat for breakfast,' don't result in branches. Such minor fluctuations are smoothed out and absorbed by the flow of more significant, decisive choices.
If 'meeting you' was one of those significant, decisive choices, then the world where 'I didn't meet you' does not exist. There's no branch like that. Because I met you, we are here now. No matter how many times I would turn back time, the result would be the same; I would meet you.
It's said that the more significant the event, the more energy it has, and it becomes a 'nail' that definitely catches the rubber band. On the other hand, trivial events don't become nails; they're like dust, ignored by the rubber band of time. For example, the 'Red String of Fate' is not something that one can see, nor is it red.
The 'Red String' is just a metaphor. But it's true that there's a force that pulls certain people together, akin to gravity. This isn't just about romance. It includes the forces that bring friends together, that draw you to certain places, or even the events that lead to you picking up this book.
The force that draws people to each other might be tiny, like gravity. Invisible, but it's there. Perhaps, it could be said that this is the true 'Red String of Fate.' Something that can’t be seen with the eyes, yet undeniable. That's what ties you and me together.
And if you trace back that string, you'll find a massive, complex web, connecting not just people, but events, and even the world's destiny. All of it is linked together by countless strings. That's why even the smallest actions have meaning. They're all part of the vast, interconnected system.
Yet, this doesn't mean that every little action we take is significant in changing the world. Most are absorbed, inconsequential in the grand scheme. But sometimes, just sometimes, there's an action that seems insignificant yet ends up changing everything.
It's like a game of pinball, where the ball, at first glance, seems to be following a straightforward path, but then it hits a nail, changing its direction entirely. Even a small nail can cause a big change in the trajectory.
This is what is so terrifying and yet so wonderful about life. You never know which nail you'll hit next. It's unpredictable, and yet, that's what makes it worth living. The 'what ifs' and the paths not taken are what lead us to the present, the undeniable now.
Each choice you make is not just your own but is influenced by the countless connections and strings you cannot see. They guide you, sometimes subtly, sometimes more overtly. It’s all part of the intricate dance of existence.
The thought that everything could be different if only one tiny thing had changed can be overwhelming. Yet, embracing that everything you experience is the accumulation of all prior choices can give you a deeper appreciation for the present moment. It helps you realize the importance of now.
And in that realization, you find the courage to make choices that matter, to make changes that resonate through the web of life. That's how you create ripples, how you influence not just your own path, but potentially the paths of others across this vast, interconnected universe."
===================================
The translation is completely wrong. Although I'm not very familiar with English, I could tell at a glance that it was nonsense. The correct translation of that passage is as follows:
"Shincheonji."
The brown-haired boy said nonchalantly, crumpling the empty milk carton as if it were nothing.
"I heard that such a collection of dreams is in my right hand. Indeed, that's right. 'I think it was called the World Rejecter' or something like that."
"...It's impossible. Parallel worlds is..."
"Yeah. It's like attaching a rubber band to a nail-studded slingshot; in the end, it's just a single line. Parallel worlds don't exist infinitely. But at the same time, the world is like a rubber band. It's flexible, like time and space. The world we know has surprisingly a lot of excess - it's like using only 10 cuts out of a 60-cut film. Even if you borrow a couple of the remaining cuts and insert a different movie subliminally, no one would notice. You wanted it, didn't you? Even though you knew it was something that could never be achieved. But you still yearned for it. You 'Magic gods'."
"After investigating the ends of the universe and every overlapping phase, and realizing that there's nothing new left at all. But if such a thing were possible... To throw away all the annoying things of this world and spread your wings in a paradise that no one knows about..."
I am quite inexperienced in English, so my English relies heavily on Claude, Anthropic's AI assistant, and DeepL translator for a significant portion of the work.
Therefore, if there are any parts of my replies that are difficult to understand, I would appreciate it if you could point them out to me clearly and specifically.
Mr.OMG
Paramount
Mr.OMG
Paramount
fiamma
Notorious
Quote from nt18 about "What If" possibilities Aleister Crowley
Time is a single path.
The past, present, and future are all connected. Parallel worlds do not mean that there are many worlds. It's like a pachinko game machine with countless nails driven into the rubber band of time. The only difference is which 'nail' it gets caught on.
The translation of the part you requested is as follows:
Regarding the quote from nt18:
My soul was shining with brilliant colors.
What could this be?
Predictions are being reviewed, and Laura Stuart's cheek twitches unpleasantly.
"Originally, all possibilities were sealed within a single body. However, even if there are multiple versions of me in the world, they would only clash with each other, and it was determined that cooperation could not be expected in most cases. From that point on, I had no choice but to bind all versions of myself to a single coordinate in a self-defeating manner. In other words, as usual, I acted without thinking and deeply regretted it."
The group said,
"When sanctions were imposed on Fiamma, you should have been able to observe a momentarily diverged version of yourself. They appear in an instant and disappear in an instant. Not only in a form similar to teleportation but also in a form that has become rare nowadays, like a fax machine."
"Wait, so that means..."
"In solving the problems of Karasuma Fran and Kihara Yuiitsu, the flow was already determined at the point when they emerged from the life support system. Even without the need for Kamijou Touma or Laura Stuart to appear, I was already swept up in an unlimited divergence. As a result, what will arise from now on is a group of 'all of me' as an if."
Laughter surrounds him.
It was undoubtedly that of the 'human' Aleister Crowley.
"If the calculations performed by the previous Tree Diagram and the values proven by Reading Thoth 78 are correct, the number of choices I can make and the number of branches that can be derived from there is 1,083,092,867. In other words, that many Aleister Crowleys exist as various possibilities. You merely witnessed that moment. Yes, no matter what you do now, you have merely witnessed it."
The issue seems to be the Ai doesn't know the full context. It doesn't know that the page is from To Aru or that there are multiple people talking. That's why it came off that way
fiamma
Notorious
Zashiki Warashi?
I haven't read the original work except for the collaboration novel "Toaru Heavy Zashiki Warashi" , so I can't confirm the details about it in the main story.
And about the misamisa novel:
＊なおこの物語は、ゴム紐並行世界理論の可能性のさらに外、無尽蔵に存在する異世界の中でも例の二人が未だ出現していないこの世界においてはフィクションであり、あくまでも現実の人物、団体等とは一切関係はない。
終 章 スタッフロール | とある魔術の禁書目録外伝 エース御坂美琴 対 クイーン食蜂操祈!! | 電撃ノベコミ＋ 全話完全無料の小説＆コミックサイト！ | 電撃文庫・電撃の新文芸公式サイト
監督・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ 助監督・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ カメラマン・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ 撮影助手・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ ドローン撮影班・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ（アンテナ付き） 脚本・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ 音響・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ 照明・輪廻女神サリナガリティーナ 特殊効果・輪廻女神サリナ...
This story is a work of fiction in a world where the two individuals in question have not yet appeared, among the countless alternate worlds that exist beyond the possibilities of the rubber band parallel world theory. It has absolutely no connection to any real people, organizations, or entities.
This simply means that there are countless alternate worlds, completely different from the ability system, that exist beyond the Index universe (similar to Bleach, Marvel, One Piece, etc.).
That's why the expression "completely unrelated to real people and organizations" is used.
fiamma
Notorious
タングラムですよ。Index世界の超能力, 厳密にはあり得ない結果を自分でつかみ取るので、その時点で平行世界をを少し改変する力ではあるですけれど、それはあくまでも、Index 世界の理の中のことなんです。[ゴムひも理論]で説明できるものなんですが、あくまでも、一つの世界の中のゴムひもしか操れない。でも、タングラムは別で、世界と世界の間で入れ替えする力が持ってるから、どんな世界のゴムひももお構いなしに.
Can you tell me where that passage came from?
I have the original Toaru Virtual On novel, but I haven't played the game myself, so I only know a brief summary of the story. Is there a part in the game that I might have missed?
Mr.OMG
Paramount
How come the AI created a rather interesting, philosophical concept of fate, from a single line about the nonexistence of an infinite number of parallel worlds?
Well, if Fiamma's translation is correct, then as I understand it, there is no infinite space of parallel worlds. There is only one single timeline, with infinite "What If" possibilities. But because of the determinism of the world/fate, there is only one trajectory of history (nails that hold history together), and parallel worlds exist only as variants of "What If", and if necessary it is possible to call these possibilities into a single and unique history.
Mr.OMG
Paramount
Interview Kamachi about Virtual-On. It also says that Othinus is equal in strength to Tangram.
One person has already translated this quote, but another translation would be nice
fiamma
Notorious
Interview Kamachi about Virtual-On. It also says that Othinus is equal in strength to Tangram.
One person has already translated this quote, but another translation would be nice
It appears in the interview section.
Othinus makes a reappearance. She appears as a being who can talk on equal terms with Tangram as a Magic God.
In the scenarios throughout the story, they are dragged against their will into a world that only gods like Othinus can perceive, somewhere between the world of "A Certain Magical Index" and the world of "Virtual On". Moreover, the power that should have already disappeared has been restored, and from her perspective, she no longer needs that power... Due to this situation, she is very irritated with Tangram at their first encounter.
The idea that the toaru world is made up of a single timeline is merely the main scientific theory currently prevalent in the Index universe. That's why even ordinary people like Kamisato can easily know about this fact. However, in reality, toaru world cannot be explained solely by that, because there exist numerous phases of pure physical laws, as well as many layers of religion and mythology stacked on top of them.
"The parallel world theory, which is considered as one of the hypotheses by the Board of Directors, is a situation that cannot be explained by our current mainstream "rubber band theory of history.
In the rubber band theory, although the world is one, it is divided into multiple branches, creating various new parallel worlds. It is closer to the image of inserting a rubber band onto a board with a large number of nails, such as in pinball or slingshot, and refracting it in various ways to create a single path. It is more like a fabrication that freely manipulates the one and only history.
On the other hand, to explain "Blue Stalker", a hypothesis that "multiple worlds literally exist in parallel" is necessary."
And according to the Virtual On novel, it is explicitly stated that these are merely hypotheses in our world, and that various parallel worlds will be generated.
However, everything we have discussed so far, and now, has no meaning in terms of scaling in Toaru.
This is because Alice, a being who can expand all the theories that appeared in Toaru worlds, regardless of their truth, falsehood, or contradictions, has appeared.
Moreover, her magic called Bridge is repeatedly and explicitly mentioned to be on the same level as Mgs' Phase manipulation, so Mgs is also expanded.
Even if the hypothesis is true and Toaru is a single timeline, this can be consistent with the part where Othinus is mentioned as an equal being to Tangram, who governs all infinite parallel worlds.
Mr.OMG
Paramount
Phases are Phases, they don't matter at this topic. I find it more interesting that Tangram and the MisaMisa novel cannot be explained by the concepts of ToAru world(Kamachi even explicitly says so in the epilogue), i.e. the perspective of a single timeline with infinite possibilities(other worlds).
