Omni-Man & Invincible (TV) vs Thor & Hulk (MCU)

[Edward Nygma]

Rules: Post-Ragnarok for the MCU fighters. Thor has Mjolnir. Standard match rules.
Location: King Kong's artificial habitat. But it's indestructible.

Spoiler

 

[Edward Nygma]

VS

 

[Atem]

In before somebody from SB sees this, and gets the idea that Twilight vampires can fight Omniman and Invincible too.

At this point nothing would surprise me.

 

[Darth Nihilus]

In before somebody from SB sees this, and gets the idea that Twilight vampires can fight Omniman and Invincible too.

 

[McNasty996]

Team 1 should win, however does post-Ragnarock mean Thor that had Stormbreaker feats just without stormbreaker? Because I don’t think either of team one have the output to push past Thor’s peak durability(with Stormbreaker) but they should be able to handle Fat Thor or Hulk.

 

[GregSteve]

What is the Amazon version Country lvl and mhs+?

 

[Edward Nygma]

Team 1 should win,

Nolan does probably hit a few times harder than Hulk or Thor. I'd have to compare the Power Stone's planet-busting feat against Nolan's off-screen planet destruction. Pretty sure both are small planet level to some degree. Obviously, Power Stone has to be well above moon level, given how casually it, you know, destroyed a moon.

Thor and Hulk likely have an edge on (quantifiable) reaction speed. We know Alan and Nolan are capable of interstellar travel, but it's never clocked. Carol has multiple interstellar trips under her belt, and none take more than a few hours. Traveling from the nearest non-Sun star in 12 hours would be 6.9k times faster than light. And a much less experienced Thor can contend with that fairly easily.

does post-Ragnarock mean Thor that had Stormbreaker feats just without stormbreaker?

Such as...?

What kind of durability has he shown w/ Stormbreaker that he hasn't shown without it? The only direct power up I remember it give was to regen, not durability.

they should be able to handle Fat Thor

People still acting like end of EG Thor is debuffed.

"The difficult road that Thor’s traveled ultimately gave him strength. He was stronger than ever by the end of Endgame." -- Russo Bros

If you mean Fat Thor before he retrieves Mjolnir, then, maybe. But we have basically no showings for that version of Thor.

 

[Edward Nygma]

What is the Amazon version Country lvl and mhs+?

It's technically off-screen, but Nolan was part of a squad of Viltrumites that nuked Allan's planet. Dividing it out put them all at small planet level.

 

[McNasty996]

Such as...?

What kind of durability has he shown w/ Stormbreaker that he hasn't shown without it? The only direct power up I remember it give was to regen, not durability.


People still acting like end of EG Thor is debuffed.

"The difficult road that Thor’s traveled ultimately gave him strength. He was stronger than ever by the end of Endgame." -- Russo Bros

If you mean Fat Thor before he retrieves Mjolnir, then, maybe. But we have basically no showings for that version of

Specifically I’m referencing the star feat(although admittedly thinking back he did that right before Stormbreaker so he should have the durability).

I don’t think either Mark or Omni-Man have shown anywhere near the output required to get near the showing of that feat(essentially standing in the stars beam for a solid 30 seconds from what I can recall) and only suffering minor exterior burns(although needing Stormbreaker to not die apparently). That should mean that they while they may be able to toss him about doing enough damage to hurt him is another question.

While that may be Thors showing in Endgame seem to be a far cry from Infinity War(although the whole Gauntlet Beam vs Stormbreaker) by many counts. A lot of people chuck it up being out of practice but he did seem noticeably less capable.

 

[Edward Nygma]

A lot of people chuck it up being out of practice but he did seem noticeably less capable.

Strongly disagree.

People keep saying this, but I've never heard any convincing examples (or many examples, at all).

Post Ragnarok, pre-Stormbreaker Thor existed for all of 5 minutes before getting absolutely handled by Thanos. Post-Stormbreaker Thor exists for another 5 minutes before he whiffs his potential OHKO. What about these two short-lived incarnations outshine Fat Thor so much?

Fat Thor contends directly with Thanos, physically, multiple times. He loses out in the end, but, like, so did the other two versions. And neither of them has anything to show for it. Fat Thor at least has on-screen showings of him getting back up after getting rekt by Thanos: reverse tug-o-war with Stormbreaker, kicked through a rock that's as large as he is, blocking swings from the helicopter sword.

What do the sexy Thors have in terms of showings vs Thanos? Getting literally tossed around like a broken ragdoll? Beheading an injured man who's being held prone? Failing to kill him with an actual plot device?

 

[Flowering Knight]

It's technically off-screen, but Nolan was part of a squad of Viltrumites that nuked Allan's planet. Dividing it out put them all at small planet level.

Yeah I don't think we can use that. Considering the nature of offscreen feats we can't qualify something like that.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

If it's the Amazon Version, Omni-Man would win.
FTL, Country to Continental. MCU Thor and Hulk are strong but not that strong unless I missed something.

 

[TrueG 37]

Nolan does probably hit a few times harder than Hulk or Thor. I'd have to compare the Power Stone's planet-busting feat against Nolan's off-screen planet destruction. Pretty sure both are small planet level to some degree. Obviously, Power Stone has to be well above moon level, given how casually it, you know, destroyed a moon.

Thor and Hulk likely have an edge on (quantifiable) reaction speed. We know Alan and Nolan are capable of interstellar travel, but it's never clocked. Carol has multiple interstellar trips under her belt, and none take more than a few hours. Traveling from the nearest non-Sun star in 12 hours would be 6.9k times faster than light. And a much less experienced Thor can contend with that fairly easily.


Such as...?

What kind of durability has he shown w/ Stormbreaker that he hasn't shown without it? The only direct power up I remember it give was to regen, not durability.


People still acting like end of EG Thor is debuffed.

"The difficult road that Thor’s traveled ultimately gave him strength. He was stronger than ever by the end of Endgame." -- Russo Bros

If you mean Fat Thor before he retrieves Mjolnir, then, maybe. But we have basically no showings for that version of Thor.

Are they talking mental strength or physically there? Almost thought the former is what they're talking about.


Edit: nevermind they start talking about how he's wielding both Stormbreaker and mjolnir.

 

[Edward Nygma]

FTL, Country to Continental. MCU Thor and Hulk are strong but not that strong unless I missed something.

Thor's star feat was calc'd at continent level per second, I'm pretty sure.

Thanos cracking the Tesseract was 50 teratons. Country level. Hulk's durability easily scales to that. Just the effort of throwing a punch would be way more effort than Thanos put into cracking that cube.

Leaving the Biforst on for about 5 minutes lets off enough energy to create a vortex/singularity capable of moving stars. This one was pretty heavily debated, but I clocked it at small planet level per second iirc. Thor shattered the Bifrost while the energy was running through it (with multiple hits), and then took the blowback point-blank. Factoring for surface area, I think country to continent level is exactly what we would be looking at for this one.

There's also the fact that Thor can, in theory, harm Thanos to a minor degree (Thunder Cap made him squeal a bit). Thanos is the dude who punched a bitch with the Power Stone. Put a bomb in his palm like some Baki shit, and then took no damage when he went for the Ganon punch.

That stone is packing at least moon level DC (it literally broke a moon on-screen) and we have a calc putting it at small planet level for nuking that planet in the Collectors little Celestials video. Even at moon level, being able to draw blood from Thanos would have to put someone in the upper continent range. If Tony's MK50 can do it given enough time, Mjolnir can do it too.

 

[Gordo]

Thanos breaking the tesseract means nothing. The MCU clearly forgets things across movies

and the Bifrost is contested because it’s a wormhole that does weird stuff to space, you can’t calc anything quantifiable out of that

 

[Edward Nygma]

Thanos breaking the tesseract means nothing. The MCU clearly forgets things across movies

Cool. We'll just drop all scaling ever.

This isn't a strawman or hyperbole. You can't cherry-pick feats to ignore on the grounds that the writers don't keep track. They are either so inconsistent that past feats "mean nothing", or we just take what we are given and work with it.

and the Bifrost is contested because it’s a wormhole that does weird stuff to space,

It doesn't do anything supernatural to space. Black holes do way fuckier shit to space-time than just making things look a bit warped.

you can’t calc anything quantifiable out of that

I can quantify how much energy was needed to move the stars in question. And, since calcs basically have to be done assuming thermodynamics and a few other basic Newtonian principles are in play, I know that the energy can't have come from anywhere but the Bifrost.

The logic is real simple: 1) stars moved, 2) the energy that moved the stars came from the Bifrost. It doesn't really matter, the exact nature of the phenomena that was created. We see the effects that phenomena has on the physical world, and we know where the energy for that effect came from.

@ChaosTheory123, you are the only other calcer that I know for sure is here on OLF. Do me a favor, if you would, and either back me up or BFO me on this take. I made the same argument back when I did the calc, and just got a vaguely "nah, that feels weird" kind of response. Am I crazy, or am I Will Smith in I, Robot?

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

Cool. We'll just drop all scaling ever.

This isn't a strawman or hyperbole. You can't cherry-pick feats to ignore on the grounds that the writers don't keep track. They are either so inconsistent that past feats "mean nothing", or we just take what we are given and work with it.

I don't think that's the thing Gordo is mentioning when he brings that up. It's more the NATURE of how it's pretty evident that the writers didn't truly pay attention combined with the later offerings doesn't really gel to that.
i.e. It comes off more of an outlier.

 

[Edward Nygma]

I don't think that's the thing Gordo is mentioning when he brings that up. It's more the NATURE of how it's pretty evident that the writers didn't truly pay attention combined with the later offerings doesn't really gel to that.
i.e. It comes off more of an outlier.

Thanos is physically strong enough to break Vibranium with his fingers and to palm the Power Stone.

What, exactly, is out of line here?

 

[ChaosTheory123]

Thanos breaking the tesseract means nothing. The MCU clearly forgets things across movies

???

By this alien logic most of Dragon Ball's powerscaling can be thrown out the window as we know for a fact Toriyama routinely forgets details and is often reminded of them by fans like Oda

Hell, makes sense with how often he regurgitates threats like destroying a planet as if it means anything even all the way into the Tournament of Power. Mind you, that one is about as hands off as it gets with Toriyama's canon and it still ends up being a late game fuck up on the part of continuity and escalating threat.

and the Bifrost is contested because it’s a wormhole that does weird stuff to space, you can’t calc anything quantifiable out of that

Didn't the bifrost thing basically have it warp space to such an extent it swallowed stars or some bullshit?

Much like how we get around FTL KE by defaulting to the celestial body's GBE or orbital KE being overpowered, this doesn't really strike me as any different

@ChaosTheory123, you are the only other calcer that I know for sure is here on OLF. Do me a favor, if you would, and either back me up or BFO me on this take. I made the same argument back when I did the calc, and just got a vaguely "nah, that feels weird" kind of response. Am I crazy, or am I Will Smith in I, Robot?

If its stars moving, it seems pretty cut and dry that its an expression of the power of the bifrost. Anything beyond that I don't follow the MCU closely enough to be concrete about.

 

[Edward Nygma]

If its stars moving, it seems pretty cut and dry that its an expression of the power of the bifrost.

Literally all that I was after. Thanks for taking the time to write all that up.