Circus of Humorous & Humiliating Arguments Part 5: Diamonds are fleeting. Stupid lasts forever

[Salfarc]

HOLY SHIT
STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS
USE FEATS
ITS THAT SIMPLE
THIS AINT HARD

THERE ARE SOME FEATS YOU LITERALLY HAVE TO MAKE ASSUMPTION.

THAT IS LITERALLY SCALING ARE.

YOU MAKE ASSUMPTION.

IF YOU STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS, YOU CAN'T SCALE ANYTHING. IF YOU STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS YOU CAN'T EVEN DO ANY INDUCTIVE REASONING. IF YOU STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS SOME FEATS END UP BEING USELESS.

...MY BROTHER IN CHRIST, WHY ARE YOU ASSUMING THEY ARE AS DURABLE AS EACH OTHER?!

Use the fucking feats they have access to! By your logic, Marvel Adamantium is the same shit as Adamantium in Overlord and thus Ainz is Universal+ as well as every goddamned person in Overlord by proxy.

There is no assumptions, there is only the evidence of absence and the absence of evidence and it's clearly obvious where Danmachi Adamantium is.

BECAUSE I LITERALLY REPEATING MYSELF THAT YOU EITHER ASSUME THEY ARE OR THEY ARE NOT. THE FUCKING FEATS ARE THERE BUT DO YOU GUYS EVEN READ? THERE IS NO DIRECT CANON EVIDENCE THE MATERIAL IN DANMACHI IS SO MUCH STRONGER AND THAT THE HUMANS AND THE ADVENTURER ARE NOT CAPABLE OF GENERATING ENERGY EQUAL TO DESTROYING PLANET IN FATE, THIS IS FICTION! WE ASSUME THEY CAN'T BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE LARGE SCALE ASSUMPTION IF WE DO.

BUT IT IS STILL ASSUMPTION. AND YES BY THAT LOGIC, WHAT YOU SAID IS CORRECT, YOU ASSUME THE MARVEL ADAMANTITE IS THE SAME OR DIFFERENT WITH OVERLORD, IT IS STILL ASSUMPTION.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH ALL OF YOU LIKE YOU ARE TREATING ASSUMPTION SOME KIND OF CARDINAL SIN WHEN YOU GUYS ARE LITERALLY USING ASSUMPTION TOO.

You haven't "dumbed it down", you are mistaken. Like you are flat out using the words incorrectly. The things you are saying are not the way things actually are. I cannot make this any clearer.

What do you mean I haven't? At least read:

If you need the same energy to destroy adamantite in fate to destroy the dungeon floor in Danmachi, that is beyond city level.

This is my point, we either assume it is or it is not.

There is no 100% confirmation the humans are exactly the same.

Even this is assuming the human are roughly the same in both verses.

The point is again, how this is all assumption.

you can in theory make a sword made of wood so similar to a real steel sword, and make a wooden shield so similar to real steel shield and have them interract and they look like real steel sword and real steel shield. But obviously they are not the same


It is not difficult concept, no one say it is. I literally repeating myself to say that you are assuming they are comparable. Nothing wrong with that, as there is nothing directly indicate they are not comparable.

Is that not dumbed down enough?...How much simpler do you need?

An assumption is something you make to close a gap in logic.

No that is not true.

Assumption is something you consider as truth or conclusion without direct evidence that specifically state/shows that.

If you heard someone got shot in the head and didn't get up, if you think that person is dead. You are making assumption.

It is logical assumption and it is still assumption.

Dude can use fire without burning himself? You assume he's fireproof.

Yes. This is logical assumption. His power may not be fireproof itself but he have possibility of having some kind of power that emulate fireproof in practice.

Or it could be that he is immune to his own fire but not other's fire. So he is technically not fireproof.

Unless the story explicitly state he is fireproof or not, it's either you assume he have some kind of fireproof or you don't.

However, the things you are saying are not assumptions. They are not based in any form of logic, in or out of the fictional universes we are discussing.

You made a stupid statement and are attempting to obfuscate that by saying "well actually everything is a stupid statement". No dude, it's just you.

Those are assumptions. Regardless if you want to accept it or not those are assumptions.

We literally need to assume because there is no official crossover between the two. Hell, if there is, it may not be canon or contradict canon and so we still need to assume.

What you are saying is based on logical assumption and when I point it out you say I am not basing on logic. I am basing on the fact that you have to make assumption here. It is logical for me to say it.

And no I never said "actually everything is a stupid statement" when did I say that? Quote me, I dare you.

I'm not making an assumption. Gareth has demonstrated the limits of his strength, and it was roughly city level. He can break adamantite. Thus adamantite has a durability of less than city level.

How do you not make assumption? Do you not consider the human in Danmachi no different than normal human in Fate, despite there is no literal statement they are the same, because there is no actual official crossover?

Adamant has deflected a shot that once bored a hole through the planet. Thus it's durability is planet level.


This is not an assumption, it's a statement of things that happened in the stories. Unless otherwise contradicted by those same stories, that is the same as objective fact in their respective universes. That's how fiction fucking works.

Yes and you are assuming the durability of Danmachi are not planet level.

Are you going to say there is no evidence to suggest that? Yes there is none, unless you assume both Adamantite are the same. If you assume they are different, then there is no evidence to suggest that.

But is there any direct statement that the power needed to destroy a planet in Fate is not required to destroy adamantite in Danmachi? None, so you are still making assumption.

I am not saying it requires that many power to destroy adamantite in Danmachi, I am pointing out how it is still assumption to not assume it requires such energy

Stop saying assumption. You are not using this word correctly.

You mean I am not using the word the way you want it to be, hence your reaction.

If there is no direct statement or showing that state/shows something is the case, you are making assumption. That's it, it's that simple.

I really don't get the allergy you guys shows to the word when you do the literal action when I am not even saying that doing it is wrong.

I'll note, however, that while Adamant, Divine Steel, and Adamas are all used for the same metal in Greek Mythology, it is never once referred to as Adamantite

Bruh this is like saying humes in FFXI is not mean to be humans since they goes by slightly different name. Despite they are meant to be humans.

This is just distinction without difference in literal definition. Like sure Danmachi Adamantite and Fate Adamantite may not have similar feat, but its obvious Adamant is mean to be adamantite

 

[Stocking Anarchy]

The last thing the CCP hears;

 

[Masterblack06]

THERE ARE SOME FEATS YOU LITERALLY HAVE TO MAKE ASSUMPTION.

Like what? give an example of a concrete feat that I need to make an assumption for

THAT IS LITERALLY SCALING ARE.

Thats not what scaling is

YOU MAKE ASSUMPTION.

IF YOU STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS, YOU CAN'T SCALE ANYTHING. IF YOU STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS YOU CAN'T EVEN DO ANY INDUCTIVE REASONING. IF YOU STOP MAKING ASSUMPTIONS SOME FEATS END UP BEING USELESS.

Its actually super fucking easy to scale without using assumptions

if you need to make shit up to fill in the gaps in order to try and show off how one character is stronger than the other then the feat is dogshit

I dont care what verse it is or who did it or where its from. If I have to do what you've been doing and trying to cross scale fictional materials to make them equal to each other despite evidence to the contrary then I aint scaling shit

 

[Doronbo_Shirake]

The last thing the CCP hears;

It's funny, because this is one of the answers in the reddit thread:

The last thing that Aslan hears as the swarm of Chinese drones clouded the sky of Narnia:



If China is going to a war with a magical kingdom they are gonna pour everything they have into it. Their elite is going to want the magic mumbo-jumbo to benefit themselves. If rich people want something they are gonna sacrifice anybody else and China has a lot of scapegoats for crazy invasions. Their industry is also the best when it comes to mass producing cheap drones that overwhelm an enemy that has no means to defend themselves effectively against a force that operates in the sky.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

BECAUSE I LITERALLY REPEATING MYSELF THAT YOU EITHER ASSUME THEY ARE OR THEY ARE NOT. THE FUCKING FEATS ARE THERE BUT DO YOU GUYS EVEN READ? THERE IS NO DIRECT CANON EVIDENCE THE MATERIAL IN DANMACHI IS SO MUCH STRONGER AND THAT THE HUMANS AND THE ADVENTURER ARE NOT CAPABLE OF GENERATING ENERGY EQUAL TO DESTROYING PLANET IN FATE, THIS IS FICTION! WE ASSUME THEY CAN'T BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE LARGE SCALE ASSUMPTION IF WE DO.

So because there is no 100% evidence(Even though there is) that Humans can't be stronger than Real Life Humans(Even though the person Split used is stronger than any living real life human) and the material can't be more durable than what is shown, we somehow have to assume that it's as strong as Fate Adamant Steel?

Salf, I'm going to say this only one time and I want you to pay attention:
What you are saying is the very fallacy of the Evidence of Absence, not realizing that it's not the end all, be all of any debate, it also makes you look insane because that's not how VS. debates work.
The Absence of Evidence is not The Evidence of Absence.

BUT IT IS STILL ASSUMPTION. AND YES BY THAT LOGIC, WHAT YOU SAID IS CORRECT, YOU ASSUME THE MARVEL ADAMANTITE IS THE SAME OR DIFFERENT WITH OVERLORD, IT IS STILL ASSUMPTION.

...Why do you believe that assumptions somehow save your ridiculous ass argument from being ridiculed and told why it's stupid? It's not a saved argument to somehow believe that basic ass minerals in Danmachi can somehow be x100 times more durable than any known material without any basis to that argument. Anymore than me making an assumption that because Kyoka Suigetsu is shown to be extremely powerful in Bleach means it's on par with Tsukuyomi, if not beyond it.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH ALL OF YOU LIKE YOU ARE TREATING ASSUMPTION SOME KIND OF CARDINAL SIN WHEN YOU GUYS ARE LITERALLY USING ASSUMPTION TOO.

We are not making assumptions on any of this... we are explicitly using what is stated in Danmachi about Adamantium and what is stated about Adamant in the Nasuverse. It's up to you to prove that what we are saying is wrong, not pretending making an assumption makes you safe from criticism.
Unless you want to pretend VS. debating as a whole is nothing but assumptions which if you believe that... boy howdy, you will be laughed out EVERYWHERE if you try and have that as a general attitude about it.

 

[CrossTheHorizon]

snip

I'm not dealing with this actual retardation anymore.

It has been exhaustively explained to you why things do not work the way you are suggesting.

You have been given every opportunity and concession to understand that what you are saying is logically and fundamentally wrong

Your continued insistence on this stance has passed beyond funny into annoying and then again into concerning.

You aren't even making actual arguments anymore, just yelling words you don't understand as loudly as possible in the desperate hope you'll burn out everyones brain

Just stop, kid.

 

[Randomdude]

So does anyone have a qoute about the death knights armor?

 

[Stocking Anarchy]

It's funny, because this is one of the answers in the reddit thread:

Creates universe
Is only hurt by things because he allows himself to be hurt
His true form transcends endless platonic layers each far greater than the last
Far weaker beings in Narnia could fuck over every army in Earth's history put together
"Nah man, we'll just shoot at him"

 

[Masterblack06]

Aslan literally flexes them out of existence

 

[Salfarc]

Like what? give an example of a concrete feat that I need to make an assumption for

Most off-screen feats need you to make assumption.

Emiya took 6 lives from Herc? You make assumption how he do it. You make assumption that he did it by himself because there is no evidence something or someone help him.

Feats of char A tanking a world busting attack and fine?

And then char B beating A in one hit?

You assume Char B is stronger than world busting attack.

Hell, sometimes you have to assume if the description from a story is real or exaggeration.

Thats not what scaling is

Its actually super fucking easy to scale without using assumptions

if you need to make shit up to fill in the gaps in order to try and show off how one character is stronger than the other then the feat is dogshit

I dont care what verse it is or who did it or where its from. If I have to do what you've been doing and trying to cross scale fictional materials to make them equal to each other despite evidence to the contrary then I aint scaling shit

? In Fate Gilgamesh never once fight Asterios. If you are to be asked if Gilgamesh or Asterios who would win, who do you think would win? Give the direct evidence of one is winning, otherwise it is assumption. Try it.

You don't have to make shit up to fill in the gaps, if you consider Saitama winning against Hans despite they never canonically nor shown in crossover to fight, you are making assumption because there is no direct evidence Saitama wins. And yet anyone can scale them and know Saitama will win based on feats.

It's quite literally impossible to scale without making assumption, such as the case above. Otherwise, you don't need to scale, you just go for the canon depiction.

So because there is no 100% evidence(Even though there is) that Humans can't be stronger than Real Life Humans(Even though the person Split used is stronger than any living real life human) and the material can't be more durable than what is shown, we somehow have to assume that it's as strong as Fate Adamant Steel?

No? see this you guys are not getting my point...But this is you so it kinda fits your usual antic.

I am just pointing out that those are assumptions.

It doesn't mean what you said here.

Salf, I'm going to say this only one time and I want you to pay attention:
What you are saying is the very fallacy of the Evidence of Absence, not realizing that it's not the end all, be all of any debate, it also makes you look insane because that's not how VS. debates work.
The Absence of Evidence is not The Evidence of Absence.



...Why do you believe that assumptions somehow save your ridiculous ass argument from being ridiculed and told why it's stupid? It's not a saved argument to somehow believe that basic ass minerals in Danmachi can somehow be x100 times more durable than any known material without any basis to that argument. Anymore than me making an assumption that because Kyoka Suigetsu is shown to be extremely powerful in Bleach means it's on par with Tsukuyomi, if not beyond it.





We are not making assumptions on any of this... we are explicitly using what is stated in Danmachi about Adamantium and what is stated about Adamant in the Nasuverse. It's up to you to prove that what we are saying is wrong, not pretending making an assumption makes you safe from criticism.
Unless you want to pretend VS. debating as a whole is nothing but assumptions which if you believe that... boy howdy, you will be laughed out EVERYWHERE if you try and have that as a general attitude about it.

If something need you to make conclusion that is not directly stated/shown it is assumption. You are making assumptions in a lot of things. Nothing is wrong with that, we have to. What is this act of denial.

What part of that is so hard to understand?

I'm not dealing with this actual retardation anymore.

It has been exhaustively explained to you why things do not work the way you are suggesting.

You have been given every opportunity and concession to understand that what you are saying is logically and fundamentally wrong

Your continued insistence on this stance has passed beyond funny into annoying and then again into concerning.

You aren't even making actual arguments anymore, just yelling words you don't understand as loudly as possible in the desperate hope you'll burn out everyones brain

Just stop, kid.

Idk brat, I agree this is retarded, from my point of view you guys are. I rest my case if you guys is that allergic to reality

I still don't get why are you guys acting like you are comitting cardinal sin as a devout christian by simply me pointing out that what you are doing is assumption. When it is. I don't even accuse you guys of doing something bad.

You guys are making assumption, you have to, stop acting like you are not. I agree that adamantite in Danmachi and Adamantite in Fate are different, and I want to conclude that as well. I am just afraid the other side will consider themselves downplayed. I agree that I shouldn't care what they think, so that's it I am reassured enough to conclude that as well because of what you guys said. Yet those are still assumptions.

I'm done.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

So does anyone have a qoute about the death knights armor?

Aren't YOU the Overlord guy?! Don't you have access to the quote?

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

No? see this you guys are not getting my point...But this is you so it kinda fits your usual antic.

This is the 4th fucking time you called me a hypocrite... for simply telling your stupid ass the truth. I will not tolerate a fifth time from someone that has never actually brought in anything truthful or meaningful to any of these discussions outside of absolute dog ass assumptions(and believing that should somehow protect you from criticism) and literally believing that materials somehow trump legit feats.

I am just pointing out that those are assumptions.

It doesn't mean what you said here.

It does, it fucking does. Assumptions do not stop you from being criticized, we do that all of the goddamned time, what the fuck do you think Universal Bleach gets criticized for? Why do you think we make fun of VSB for?! For the yucks?
Your assumption is literally predicated on things that the franchise itself clarifies itself for somehow being wrong because you said so, that's a ridiculous ass assumption because on an Appeal To Ignorance, an extremely shitty and unironically SB approach to debates.

If something need you to make conclusion that is not directly stated/shown it is assumption. You are making assumptions in a lot of things. Nothing is wrong with that, we have to. What is this act of denial.

Okay, so Bleach is Megaversal right? Because you can't prove that Bleach isn't a Megaverse. Why stop there? Why don't we also believe that Haruhi Suzuiyama is capable of TOTA grade feats because we never seen her maximum before, she can absolutely affect everything on a macrocosm scale.
Hell, why not go with Reality Marbles being Universal and Arcueid's body being a Universe, let's just go all out because it seems as such, that must mean we have to assume it is right then and there.
And you can't say that these are dumb because these are also assumptions and you can't deny them at all.

What part of that is so hard to understand?

The fact you are doing this to cater to people who don't even use these as an actual argument...

Maybe that's why I and others can't understand it...
I'm fucking done for tonight...

 

[Randomdude]

Aren't YOU the Overlord guy?! Don't you have access to the quote?

Im not the one that suggested the death knights armor is made of several metals/made of adamantite, such was suggested by the users here, I have no recollection of any such statement, Ive begun looking but if someone has it or atleast an inkling of what book its in it would save me time.

My suspicion is they're just wrong as it's not even mentioned on the wiki which usually has the decency to mention such random info, even if only in reference to the webnovel.

If the qoute exist I should have access to it, if it doesn't Im going to be wasting quite a bit of time hunting for it.

 

[Masterblack06]

Most off-screen feats need you to make assumption.

Emiya took 6 lives from Herc? You make assumption how he do it. You make assumption that he did it by himself because there is no evidence something or someone help him.

You dont make an assumption
there is nothing to assume
Herc lost 6 lives to emiya
Instead of Assuming what happened, you go by what is shown or told
You ask questions, get answers and then that is your feat
If you can't get the answers to the basic questions to quantify the feat then the feat is just unquantifiable and you just leave it there till you either get more information

Feats of char A tanking a world busting attack and fine?

And then char B beating A in one hit?

You assume Char B is stronger than world busting attack.

You dont assume that. If A tanks planet busting fire power and then loses to B in one hit, you look at the context of what happened and base your STATEMENT off that.
If A tanks the planet busting attack thats unga bunga with his raw durability and then B beats him through raw unga bunga then B is 100% stronger than that planet busting.
If A tanks the planet busting thats unga bunga through a special ability or some form of hax and then B beats him through Unga Bunga then B is 100& stronger than that planet busting
etc etc. you get the point

Hell, sometimes you have to assume if the description from a story is real or exaggeration.

I dont go by descriptions of shit. Its one reason I hate how feats in dark souls and the like are done

? In Fate Gilgamesh never once fight Asterios. If you are to be asked if Gilgamesh or Asterios who would win, who do you think would win? Give the direct evidence of one is winning, otherwise it is assumption. Try it.

I can't do that because I barely know Gilgamesh outside of the anime and I have no idea who asterios is.

You don't have to make shit up to fill in the gaps, if you consider Saitama winning against Hans despite they never canonically nor shown in crossover to fight, you are making assumption because there is no direct evidence Saitama wins. And yet anyone can scale them and know Saitama will win based on feats.

You dont need to assume a damn thing
You compare and contrast the feats my guy
and then you make a definitive statement based off that.
God damn dude how many times do I need to say this.
Stop assuming, Use the feats

It's quite literally impossible to scale without making assumption, such as the case above. Otherwise, you don't need to scale, you just go for the canon depiction.

See what I said above

 

[King of 🌽]

Kamen Rider Geats vs Yuji Itadori

The Fox vs The Sorcerer Encounter Arc Geats with only the Magnum Buckle and Post-Shibuya Incident Arc Yuji. Speed equalized. Victory via SBA.

vsbattles.com

. @Masterblack06

 

[Claudio Swiss]

Scourge VS Broly

Because they're both green as a result of a mutated power and are parallels to the good main character also sonic vs goku has been a thing for a while. It's super scourge vs DBS movie Broly

www.fanverse.org

Super scrouge tears Broly apart

 

[Paxton]

https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/strike-cruiser-axiorrhage-exordia-assaults-academy-city-toaru.1168089/?post=102111207#post-102111207

Invest in Accelerator stocks.

 

[Salfarc]

 

[King of 🌽]

 

[King of 🌽]

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Most people who say the real world wins over gil are disliked