Circus of Humorous & Humiliating Arguments Part 1: OBD 2027 prologue edition

[Dead Lock]

That's a pretty funny bird sculpture.

 

[Maddie]

Here is a simple explanation for a woodin cardinal:

We first introduce the concept of γ-strongness for A: an ordinal κ is γ-strong for A (or γ-A-strong) if there exists a nontrivial elementary embedding j:V→M with critical point κ such that Vκ+γ⊆M and A∩Vκ+γ=j(A)∩Vκ+γ. Intuitively, j preserves the part of A that is in Vκ+γ. We say that a cardinal κ is <δ-A-strong if it is γ-A-strong for all γ<δ.

We also introduce Woodin-ness in δ: for an infinite ordinal δ, a set X⊆δ is Woodin in δ if for every function f:δ→δ, there is an ordinal κ∈X with {f(β):β<κ}⊆κ (κ is closed under f), there exists a nontrivial elementary embedding j:V→M with critical point κ such that Vj(f)(κ)⊆M.

An inaccessible cardinal δ is Woodin if any of the following (equivalent) characterizations holds (Kanamori, 2009):

• For any set A⊆Vδ, there exists a κ<δ that is <δ-A-strong.
• For any set A⊆Vδ, the set S={κ<δ:κ is <δ-A-strong} is stationary in δ.
• The set F={X⊆δ:δ∖X is not Woodin in δ} is a proper filter, the Woodin filter over δ.
• For every function f:δ→δ there exists κ<δ such that {f(β):β∈κ}⊆κ (that is, κ is closed under f) and there exists a nontrivial elementary embedding j:V→M with critical point κ such that Vj(f)(κ)⊆M.

Let δ be Woodin, F be the Woodin filter over δ, and S={κ<δ:κ is <δ-A-strong}. Then F is normal and S∈F. (Kanamori, 2009) This implies every Woodin cardinal is Mahlo and preceeded by a stationary set of measurable cardinals, in fact of <δ-strong cardinals. However, the least Woodin cardinal is not weakly compact as it is not Π11-indescribable.

Woodin cardinals are weaker consistency-wise then superstrong cardinals. In fact, every superstrong is preceeded by a stationary set of Woodin cardinals. On the other hand the existence of a Woodin is much stronger than the existence of a proper class of strong cardinals.

The existence of a Woodin cardinal implies the consistency of ZFC + “the nonstationary ideal on ω1 is ω2-saturated”. Huge cardinals were first invented to prove the consistency of the existence of a ω2-saturated σ-ideal on ω1, but turned out to be stronger than required, as a Woodin is enough

 

[Dead Lock]

Show the feats

 

[Maddie]

Show the feats

It was my mandate. It was successful, in its own terms.

This is my mandate from the downstreamers. To explore the multiverse they created. To look at all the ways life could be played out, all the possibilities inherent in it. To let it run.

'Even if people had to die to achieve that?'

The downstreamers are not destroyers of worlds. They are creators. Enrichers-

I’m still blown away by what I’ve learned of the Old Ones.

The Old Ones created infinite possibility – infinite opportunities for life, for mind. What higher mission could there be?

To redesign an infinite ensemble of universes: what terrible responsibility, what arrogance...

Downstreamers created the multiverse, they experiment and observe them. Said multiverse composes every mathematical logical formalism possible, with any mathematically possible universe. Said mathematics include the woodin cardinality, which is basically unquantifiable and hard to even describe because there's so many things between it and what can be described as even megaversal+.

The stuff they experiment and fuck with is so large in scope, their reality-warping/mathematics manipulation/spatio-temporal manipulation would be absurdly impressive.

 

[Dead Lock]

Said multiverse composes every mathematical logical formalism possible, with any mathematically possible universe.

Your second scan doesn't say this, and even if it did, hypothetical mathematical equations =/= feats of creating a multiverse with actual infinite levels of existence/universes. Which is what we know they actually did from that scan.

Unless you are willing to say that Eternity's avatars are megaversal+, and Marvel Kronos is also megaversal+, i wouldn't mind that, tbh.

 

[Flowering Knight]

 

[Dead Lock]

Doom Slayer kills everyone here by walking by them really fast.

Also who are you on NF?

 

[Flowering Knight]

Doom Slayer kills everyone here by walking by them really fast.

Also who are you on NF?

Manlius II, though I never really did anything other than lurk on there. So this place is basically a fresh start.

 

[Dead Lock]

Manlius II, though I never really did anything other than lurk on there. So this place is basically a fresh start.

The avatar really threw me off, i thought you we're a certain bleach stan.

 

[Flowering Knight]

The avatar really threw me off, i thought you we're a certain bleach stan.

Nah, that's just a certain Dragon of Dojima. Who easily solos the entire HST via quality alone.

 

[Dead Lock]

Seems bout right

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

Makima (Chainsawman) runs a Servant gauntlet (Fate)

Francis Drake (Rider) Vlad III (Lancer of Black) Arjuna (Archer) Brynhildr (Lancer) Scathach (Lancer) Ishtar (Archer) Achilles (Rider) Karna (Lancer) Sigurd (Saber) Artoria Pendragon (Saber) Ozymandias (Rider) Enkidu (Lancer) Gilgamesh (Archer) Quetzalcoalt (Rider) King Hassan (Grand Assassin)...

forums.spacebattles.com

It's beginning to get hilarious that people really are trying to treat Makima like she's a major deal to Servants when outside of her Finger Guns and one Reaction feat against Gun, she would lose to virtually all of them, even with the other abilities from the other Demons.

 

[Sir Huxley Rex Bolex IV]

Unless you are willing to say that Eternity's avatars are megaversal+, and Marvel Kronos is also megaversal+, i wouldn't mind that, tbh.

To be honest, I wouldn't mind that either, given the kind of "macroverse" bullshit that tends to go on in comic book land.

 

[Dead Lock]

To be honest, I wouldn't mind that either, given the kind of "macroverse" bullshit that tends to go on in comic book land.

We already know Marvel contains fictional versions of people from our world, and from a certain Doctor Strange scan we also know that includes the likes of Georg Cantor, Einstein, Newton, Henri Poincare, "And the list could go on". You'd have to prove that the guy who created the Wooden Bird Cardinal also doesn't exist in Marvel, which you can't, which is only made harder when there's more evidence supporting that he does.

He even said those mathematical theories are the concepts that make up the multiverse.

You know what means?

Megaversal+ base Galactus he did throw hands with the Scrier after all.

And Omniversal fractions of Oblivion, Mikaboshi almost ate all of the multiverse after all.

 

[Dead Lock]

I'm obviously being facetious, but you get the point, i find that way of thinking convoluted and dumb.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

Star and Stripe (My Hero Academia) vs Siegfried (Fate)

Stars and stripes wins more often than not. She wins round 1 and 3 (high-diff), with 2 a potential loss depending on how quickly Sieg decides to turn into Fafnir. Not at all. Sieg was just as powerful as Siegfried. The novel repetedly emphasised it. He just lacked the heroic will to go plus...

forums.spacebattles.com

Stars and stripes wins more often than not. She wins round 1 and 3 (high-diff), with 2 a potential loss depending on how quickly Sieg decides to turn into Fafnir.

Believing Sieg needs fucking Fafnir to defeat Star and Stripe and Siegfried would somehow lose despite Karna throwing this type of attack out there on the typical basis:

And Sieg basically took it like it's nothing

Not at all. Sieg was just as powerful as Siegfried. The novel repetedly emphasised it. He just lacked the heroic will to go plus ultra (lol).

Let's ignore the anime which it explicitly states no he couldn't, what does the Tie-In Material to the Novel state?
Fate/Apocrypha material - Encyclopedia: Dragon Revelation Command Spells [Others], p.176 [T]

Dragon Revelation Command Spells [Others]
Dead Count Shapeshifter. The unique Command Spells engraved on Sieg. They can also be used as normal Command Spells, but there was absolutely no need for Sieg to force Astolfo to do anything with a Command Spell, so he used them all to turn himself into Siegfried. To explain it simply, they basically let Sieg summon Siegfried every time he uses one. The catalyst is Siegfried’s living heart. However, while Siegfried’s body could withstand the dragon blood within it, Sieg’s body can’t. That is reason that the spots on Sieg’s hand where the Command Spells disappeared from turned black. Even after he used them all up, power Sieg obtained from Frankenstein’s “Blasted Tree: Lightning Branch of Crucifixion” managed to barely maintain his human form, but that too was used up when Sieg used this Noble Phantasm at the end.

No... no he couldn't, that's why he became Fafnir in the end, he explicitly CAN'T withstand Siegfried's power nor the Dragonblood running through his heart.

Siegfried ain't surviving if any of her hits hit him directly. Sieg was only survive BK after he "equalled" it with 2 Balmungs. AoF isn't tough enough to survive her attacks without Balmung softening them up.

Karna literally throws around attacks that make whatever SnS does look like a firecracker, the fuck is he talking about?



That's not even a Noble Phantasm, it just something he threw out and that's basically the attack that would have killed Shigaraki if he didn't dig underground and SnS needed help with that. And Sieg literally no sold that shit as if it was just some random ass attack thrown at him

 

[Dead Lock]

Star and Stripe (My Hero Academia) vs Siegfried (Fate)

Stars and stripes wins more often than not. She wins round 1 and 3 (high-diff), with 2 a potential loss depending on how quickly Sieg decides to turn into Fafnir. Not at all. Sieg was just as powerful as Siegfried. The novel repetedly emphasised it. He just lacked the heroic will to go plus...

forums.spacebattles.com

Believing Sieg needs fucking Fafnir to defeat Star and Stripe and Siegfried would somehow lose despite Karna throwing this type of attack out there on the typical basis:

And Sieg basically took it like it's nothing



Let's ignore the anime which it explicitly states no he couldn't, what does the Tie-In Material to the Novel state?
Fate/Apocrypha material - Encyclopedia: Dragon Revelation Command Spells [Others], p.176 [T]


No... no he couldn't, that's why he became Fafnir in the end, he explicitly CAN'T withstand Siegfried's power nor the Dragonblood running through his heart.



Karna literally throws around attacks that make whatever SnS does look like a firecracker, the fuck is he talking about?



That's not even a Noble Phantasm, it just something he threw out and that's basically the attack that would have killed Shigaraki if he didn't dig underground and SnS needed help with that. And Sieg literally no sold that shit as if it was just some random ass attack thrown at him

I don't get the obsession with that bitch, she's not even good waifu material. she's like a 1.4 on the muscle girl scale.

Despicable.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

I don't get the obsession with that bitch, she's not even good waifu material. she's like a 1.4 on the muscle girl scale.

Despicable.

Because she did some really impressive shit... for MHA and thus, she's suddenly can handle people she couldn't because people can't stop wanking the fuck out of her and her abilities.

 

[Dead Lock]

The Question solos her with harsh truths.

That's the truth, btw.

 

[Xhominid The Apex]

The Question solos her with harsh truths.

That's the truth, btw.

It's funny because Chaos brought up a very good point:
Normal Boy Sieg wouldn't even need Siegfried's form to kick her ass as he was able to tussle with a Servant in the first place and has the bullshit Galvanism on top of that(aka literally take in anything that uses energy as energy to either fuel himself or heal himself):

Galvanism A
Unrestricted conversion of bio-electric currents and mana, as well as storing them.
Attacks with no substance to them, such as magic beams, magical winds, magic bullets, are instantly converted into electricity. The absorbed electricity is used by Nikola Tesla to replenish his mana.

Galvanism B:
Free conversion, as well as accumulation, of electric current and mana from living organisms.
It invalidates attacks without substance like magical light, magical wind, or magical bullets, by instantly converting them into electricity and discharging it into the environment.
Also, the body is strengthened depending on the amount of stored electricity, and the repair of damage is done more quickly.

Meaning that the wrong move from SnS... will just heal Sieg and make his next hit even worse than the last LMFAO.